A bizarre theory of the MJK murder

[Observer]

Hello Colin. Thanks.

"I have to admit to not knowing the going rate for a better class whore with her own home, but I'm assuming the cost would be measured in shillings rather than pence."

Then I wonder if the information is available? If in shillings, she would soon be out of debt to McCarthy.

Cheers.
LC

With her drinking habit? I don't think so

[Wickerman]

Hi Michael,

Could you direct me to the source? Dr. Bond's post-mortem report doesn't give this information.

Hi Frank.
Just in case Michael couldn't find an example, I have read something along those lines myself.

In early reports we do read..

"...Some of the internal parts of the body had been taken away, while, in addition, one arm was almost severed from the trunk, and one hand thrust inside the empty cavity of the abdomen."
Daily News 10 Nov. 1888.

I can't find it repeated after the 10th or elaborated upon, but we read nothing to contest it either.
In the 'body-on-the-bed' photo her right arm is extended awkwardly perpendicular to the torso.
Equally though, there are reports her head was cut off, but Bond's report describing the cuts to the vertebra but not mentioning actual separation tends to suggest this detail was wrong.

Regards, Jon S.

[Errata]

Hello Mike. Thanks.

I suppose opportunity is what one makes of it.

Cheers.
LC

I would think that if he really wanted to kill people indoors, he would suck it up and take widowed women in their own homes, or shop girls who are closing up. If a killer is going to insist on Whitechapel prostitutes, he is pretty much reduced to killing them in the streets.

[lynn cates]

finding a way

Hello Errata. Thanks. Agreed. If killing indoors were his object, I'm sure he would have found a way before Miller's Court.

Cheers.
LC

[Wickerman]

Most of the women on the streets lived in doss houses, with Kelly he got lucky, she had a room.

Good that you brought that up, statistically sooner or later he would get one who had a room but the majority 'entertained' out on the street.

And yes, I believe Kelly picked up JTR out on the street. I would hazard a guess that if you were to take into account the amount of women on the streets in late 1888, only one in six would have had a rented room. Six victims, one with a room.

I agree, Kelly met her killer out on the street.

Regards, Jon S.

[Wickerman]

I would think that if he really wanted to kill people indoors, he would suck it up and take widowed women in their own homes, or shop girls who are closing up. If a killer is going to insist on Whitechapel prostitutes, he is pretty much reduced to killing them in the streets.

The killer needed to fulfill a desire, to kill women.
He targeted prostitutes because they were an easy target, and readily available, that's all.
Any woman would do but prostitutes lend themselves to his cause.

He knows he will be killing out on the streets, that comes with the turf, but, if one should have a room of their own, and he could gain admittance without being seen, then that's just icing on the cake.

Regards, Jon S.

[FrankO]

Hi Michael,

Precisely my good man. The opportunity for the killer to use locations and find appropriate spots to have prolonged interaction with the corpse always existed.

The opportunity was there (although one seriously has to wonder how abundantly - or not), but the decision to actually try and find appropriate locations or suitable victims with a room of their own is another thing. It would depend entirely on the type of killer the Ripper. Was he socially apt enough to get his victims to go to these private locations? Was he able to control himself enough to give himself time to try and find the appropriate locations and/or victims? Or was he just so needy to get his fix that he couldn’t bother trying to find these locations and/or suitable victims?

The fact of the matter is that we have 3 victims who were killed and mutilated out in the streets (and not in some private spot), and as far as I can see there are 2 possible reasons for why he killed outside. He either purposefully did so because of the thrill and shock value those outside murders gave him. Or he did so because he saw no other way, was too needy and/or too socially inapt to do it in another way.

The fact that he mutilated at least 3 women within a very short period of time suggests to me that it was the latter. He went the quick & easy way by choosing the victims he was probably most familiar with: the prostitutes of Whitechapel. They were always there, possibly challenging him every now and then. And it seems that most of these women conducted business out in the streets.

All the best,
Frank

[FrankO]

Hello Frank. Thanks. Delighted to.

I am thinking of the analogy of a retired person. "For years I wanted to do X, but never had the time. Now I'm retired, I have time."

So, if this is the case with "MJK's" assailant ("I wanted complete destruction, but never had time, so I did it quickly in the street."), one wonders why he did not simply move indoors at the beginning? The retiree has "I must work" as an excuse. But surely the assailant could have done an "MJK" at any point?

Hi Lynn,

Thanks for rephrasing/the analogy. Makes it much clearer, although what you write is not what I meant. It's actually the inverse. My guess is that the Ripper needed a quick & easy fix rather than that he was willing to find some private indoor location, that way limiting risks and offering the opportunity to have more time with the body.

Cheers,
Frank

[FrankO]

Just in case Michael couldn't find an example, I have read something along those lines myself.

In early reports we do read..

"...Some of the internal parts of the body had been taken away, while, in addition, one arm was almost severed from the trunk, and one hand thrust inside the empty cavity of the abdomen."
Daily News 10 Nov. 1888.

Thanks, Jon! However, as Dr. Bond's report mentions quite a lot of detail but doesn't mention the right arm being almost severed from the trunk, for the time being I remain inclined to believe that it in fact wasn't severed.

In the 'body-on-the-bed' photo her right arm is extended awkwardly perpendicular to the torso.

I'm afraid I don't see this, in fact I don't see the right arm in either of the in-situ photos.

Cheers,
Frank

[Michael W Richards]

Hi Folks,

Thanks for locating that piece Jon, to be honest I have'nt had time the past week to do much back checking.I admit freely to offering information sometimes without immediate attribution because I work almost entirely by memory, and when one makes multiple reads of the same materials over and over again one tends to lose some of the source memory. I do this even though I realize Im imperfect. Kind of a contradictory way to go about it I suppose, but hey, we all have our methods.

On the issue of impulse Frank, I believe that impulsive behavior is likely connected with the first 2 Canonicals. A spontaneous irresistible urge. The second urge was slightly more thought out...he needed privacy to get the organs out. Too risky on the street...almost got caught in the act in Bucks Row.

I think the motivation for murder is certainly different for #3, and likely for the remaining 2.

I think the murder indoors was because the target was indoors at the time. I dont believe that 1, 2 or perhaps 3 were any kind of "target". Wrong place, wrong time.

Cheers mates

[lynn cates]

easy

Hello Frank. Thanks.

Yet one wonders why he did not arrange it so that he could spend more time with the body before? Seems easily done.

Cheers.
LC