Does The Killer Scope Out Locations Before He Kills?

[NotBlamedForNothing]

hey herlock
but what about bs man makes you think he was familiar with that location?

That question is illogical.
One cannot legitimately ask questions about an identity that has not been linked to actual individual, with at least some degree of confidence.
Who is BS Man? Where does he live?

We only know of this identity through a story told to Abberline by Schwartz.
What do we know about Israel Schwartz? Very little, ironically.
Yet you're happy to talk about people from his story, as through it were an uncontroversial fact that they existed.
Show me a press report that provides good evidence that the police have determined who either BS Man or Pipeman is, including name and address...

[Abby Normal]

I understand your point. But then when you look at the behaviour of other serials, it does present itself as a possibility. Any number of them including GSK actively surveilled or creepy-crawled houses of potential victims. GSK actually hid ligatures under cushions etc so that they'd be there when he needed them. The thing is I'm not going to dismiss the possibility that this serial killer was not equally as cool and calculating as a bank robber. In fact his behaviour seems to have been extremely organized. He kills first. Takes his trophies. Disappears. He doesn't seem to panic even when someone walks or rides right in on a murder in progress which is what happened in Duffield's Yard. Which is why I think he does notice and explore places where he thinks he can get away with murder. And get away with murder he certainly did.

i agree that the the ripper was highly organized. and very familiar with the east end. i also think he may have known mary kelly and her place. and he may have been familiar with the spots he killed, especially if he frequented prostitutes,and hung out in local bars like i think he probably did. but i still think he let them lead him to their spots.. false sense of security, they also now the best places etc. now that being said, i dont think its out of the question he may also have known those spots they took him and hung around NEAR them, knowing thats where they might take them. i dont think he actually hung out at the murder spots.. hed be waiting around too long and probably if a woman showed up they would already be with a client.

[c.d.]

The thing is I'm not going to dismiss the possibility that this serial killer was not equally as cool and calculating as a bank robber.

Hello Chava,

Neither am I. My point is that his behavior does not have to be all one way or another. We have no way of knowing if an overwhelming desire to kill ever outweighed his usual demeanor and previously adhered to M.O.

c.d.

[Chava]

Hello Chava,

I am afraid that this is a question that will never be answered. The problem is that we are dealing with a serial killer and not a cool, calculating bank robber. So no matter how cautious he might have been in pre-selecting the murder locations there is always the possibility that the desire to kill in general or to kill a particular victim overrode any other considerations.

c.d.

I understand your point. But then when you look at the behaviour of other serials, it does present itself as a possibility. Any number of them including GSK actively surveilled or creepy-crawled houses of potential victims. GSK actually hid ligatures under cushions etc so that they'd be there when he needed them. The thing is I'm not going to dismiss the possibility that this serial killer was not equally as cool and calculating as a bank robber. In fact his behaviour seems to have been extremely organized. He kills first. Takes his trophies. Disappears. He doesn't seem to panic even when someone walks or rides right in on a murder in progress which is what happened in Duffield's Yard. Which is why I think he does notice and explore places where he thinks he can get away with murder. And get away with murder he certainly did.

[Abby Normal]

Wouldn’t he be making it harder for himself Chava? It would almost have been a case of ‘shepherding.’ I know that your not suggesting that he hung around Mitre Square hoping for luck but if he was in that vicinity and met up with a prostitute (maybe a couple of streets away) who pointed at a likely spot wouldn’t she have been suspicious if her punter expressed a preference for a different spot?

I struggle with the idea of the killer being too familiar with the locations though as this would introduce the added risk of being recognised. It’s one of the reasons that I’m not keen on BS Man (Sorry Abby) or Hutchinson or Packers Man.

Im not saying that I’m right Chava but I’ve always tended to think that the ripper would have been led by the victim and reassured that they were in a ‘safe’ spot (possibly with the victim saying that she’d used the spot before with no problem)

hey herlock
but what about bs man makes you think he was familiar with that location?

[c.d.]

Hello Chava,

I am afraid that this is a question that will never be answered. The problem is that we are dealing with a serial killer and not a cool, calculating bank robber. So no matter how cautious he might have been in pre-selecting the murder locations there is always the possibility that the desire to kill in general or to kill a particular victim overrode any other considerations.

c.d.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Wouldn’t he be making it harder for himself Chava? It would almost have been a case of ‘shepherding.’ I know that your not suggesting that he hung around Mitre Square hoping for luck but if he was in that vicinity and met up with a prostitute (maybe a couple of streets away) who pointed at a likely spot wouldn’t she have been suspicious if her punter expressed a preference for a different spot?

I struggle with the idea of the killer being too familiar with the locations though as this would introduce the added risk of being recognised. It’s one of the reasons that I’m not keen on BS Man (Sorry Abby) or Hutchinson or Packers Man.

Im not saying that I’m right Chava but I’ve always tended to think that the ripper would have been led by the victim and reassured that they were in a ‘safe’ spot (possibly with the victim saying that she’d used the spot before with no problem)

[Chava]

I've always been fascinated by the locations of the killings, as all of them with the exception of Nicholls in Buck's Row take place in broadened out areas which are arrived at through narrow passages. I thought the victims might have self-selected this way as they led their punter to these places. But now I'm wondering if it's possible that The Whitechapel Murderer is a lot more organized than he appears, and perhaps he did what a number of serials have done since, which is scout locations and check on them carefully before committing a murder there. If that's the case, then he would know about prostitutes taking their tricks to the backyard or 1st floor of 29 Hanbury Street. He would perhaps even know the customs of the people living in that house--what time they woke & went out to work etc etc. He may even have visited that back yard. He would know that the Club in Duffield's Yard was raucous and loud until late so that a killing in the shadows might not be overheard. He would know that the warehouse caretakers in Mitre Square didn't venture out at night and that few people were walking in that neighbourhood in the small hours. If Nicholls was the first, he didn't get what he was after. Sounds like he was disturbed probably by the guys who found the body. He may have decided to be more careful in future. And if so, it paid off for him. Which means he might be site-specific rather than victim-specific. He decides it's his night for fun. Hangs around his chosen location. Waits for someone to go--or totter--by. Says 'hallo'.