Faecal matter on apron piece

[Phil Carter]

This document was mentioned on the 'Bury' thread recently :

"The Jack the Ripper Murders: A Modus Operandi and ... Murders", Journal of Investigative Psychology and Offender Profiling " Try googling it and downloading the pdf

It is quite clear and logical that both the MO, and more importantly the 'signature' show that the Canonicals + Tabram were killed by the same hand.

Before anyone sneers and refutes 'offender profiling' -read the document.

The Jack the Ripper murders: a modus operandi and signature ...
angela1simpson.galeon.com/jack.pdf -

Hello Ruby,

All very well and good. An expert view.
Ask 'the public in general' (which I wrote) about Jack the Ripper and invariably the comment you'll get is 'Wasn't he the bloke that killed a load of women in London?' 'They reckon it was some Royal bloke'. Ask a quantity. VERY few will say 5. (or 6).

Again, with respect, I suggest we back to the topic of the thread.

Best wishes

Phil

[Phil Carter]

Mr. Phillips did not see Kate Eddowes' body in situ. Brown did send a dispatch to advise Phillips of the murder and a request for his assistance, only to find that the H division surgeon was involved with a murder of his own. Eddowes was then conveyed to the Golden Lane mortuary with the understanding that Phillips would arrive there as soon as practicable. Phillips arrived some time after 5:20 a.m. with the apron piece found in Goulston St. while Brown's preliminary examination was underway. Phillips did participate in that procedure and agreed to return at 2:30 p.m. for the official post-mortem.

Hello Cris,

'Phillips arrived some time after 5:20am with the apron piece'

When did Collard and Halse arrive there again?

Best wishes

Phil

[Hunter]

I don't think any medico advised with respect to the investigation.

Each medico who prepared a report on the post-mortem of the murder he was involved in would have included recommendations for the investigation at the conclusion of his report. Both Brown and Phillips submitted one on the Mitre Square murder and Insp.. Swanson makes mention of this in his summary report on this murder. The conclusions he relates is very telling.

I would have thought Nichols, Chapman, Edd owes. As you recall, Baxter seems to have allowed Polly through Kate as canonical in SPITE of his misgivings. He remarked the obvious differences in the cutting, but noted the similarities in:

1. Doing the job quickly.

2. Not getting caught.

Baxter was referring to the Stride murder here, not the Eddowes murder, which he considered a possible imitation of the Chapman murder.

I don't think Don will mind me mentioning this, but there is a very long article upcoming in the New Independant Review which addresses all of this. It follows Bagster Phillips throughout the whole skien chronologically and addresses the medical evidence, the anatomical knowledge/skill debate, the views of the various medicos as well as Wynne Baxter's, and why these views were expressed... along with discussing how post-mortem examinations were conducted during that time. I believe it will offer some clarity on a critical aspect of this case that has often been misperceived by Ripperologists for various reasons.

[Jon Guy]

Mr. Phillips did not see Kate Eddowes' body in situ. Brown did send a dispatch to advise Phillips of the murder and a request for his assistance, only to find that the H division surgeon was involved with a murder of his own. Eddowes was then conveyed to the Golden Lane mortuary with the understanding that Phillips would arrive there as soon as practicable. Phillips arrived some time after 5:20 a.m. with the apron piece found in Goulston St. while Brown's preliminary examination was underway. Phillips did participate in that procedure and agreed to return at 2:30 p.m. for the official post-mortem.

Yes, my error. I thought it would have been a long time before they could move the body. But the burning question was did Baxter see Eddowes?

[Hunter]

When did Collard and Halse arrive there again?

Hi Phil,

I don't know offhand. My power is out at home at the moment due to storms and I don't have access to my notes and references. I do know that Collard was there when Eddowes' body was stripped and that Foster made his sketches soon after ( 3:45 a.m.) This was the first time that a police inspector and surgeon worked together in this manner in this series of murders. I seem to recall that Collard was also there when Phillips arrived with the piece of apron from Goulston St.

Both Collard and Halse moved around a lot that morning as did others (Phillips was all over the place). They were reacting to a rapidly developing situation involving two murders and a tangible piece of evidence.

[Phil Carter]

Hello Cris,

Many thanks- I too am without my notes and books atm- hence the question.

Best wishes

Phil

[Monty]

Halse states he passed through Goulston st at approx 2.20am.

Brown was in Mitre Sq at 2.18am.

Halse states he went from Goulston St to Mitre Sq.

Halse then states he went from Mitre Sq to Golden lane, one assumes after Brown had conducted his prelims and had the body transported to Golden Lane mortuary which is around 10 mins away.

Halse and Collard observe the undressing of Eddowes and Halse notes the apron piece missing.


Monty

[Jon Guy]

Foster made his sketches soon after ( 3:45 a.m.)

Wasnt` it 5.45 that Foster made his sketches?

[Monty]

Jon,

Foster made his sketch of Eddowes at the mortuary at 3.45am.

We know this because he stated it clearly on his plans presented at the inquest.

Monty

[Jon Guy]

Hi Neil

It looks like a 5 to me when I zoom in on the sketch.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Jon,



Regards,

Simon

[Jon Guy]

Thanks Simon, that`s a lot sharper than the Casebook copy. So, it`s definitely a 5 then. ;-)

[Simon Wood]

Hi John,

Absolutely.

5.45 am on September 50th.

Regards,

Simon

[lynn cates]

good luck

Hello Cris. Thanks.

"Each medico who prepared a report on the post-mortem of the murder he was involved in would have included recommendations for the investigation at the conclusion of his report. Both Brown and Phillips submitted one on the Mitre Square murder and Insp.. Swanson makes mention of this in his summary report on this murder. The conclusions he relates is very telling."

I meant with respect to HOW to conduct the investigation, eg, what type of person sought, one, two, etc.

"I don't think Don will mind me mentioning this, but there is a very long article upcoming in the New Independent Review which addresses all of this. It follows Bagster Phillips throughout the whole skien chronologically and addresses the medical evidence, the anatomical knowledge/skill debate, the views of the various medicos as well as Wynne Baxter's, and why these views were expressed... along with discussing how post-mortem examinations were conducted during that time. I believe it will offer some clarity on a critical aspect of this case that has often been misperceived by Ripperologists for various reasons."

Sounds interesting. Good luck.

Cheers.
LC

[Hunter]

Foster made his sketches at 3:45 a.m.
Are we in the Twilight Zone here?
Look at the date on that caption... Septr 30, 1888. Its the same typeset. It could not have been Septr 50.