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I had some time yesterday, so did a bit of reading about on the forum, and I came across a very interesting thread by Corey explaining his theory that JtR
was suffering from a Narssistic Personality Disorder. It rang true to me, so I had a go at ticking off some boxes as a 'bit of fun'.
It doesn't prove anything at all of course, as we have so little info to go on in the case of Hutch and/or Toppy, but I had a go at playing around with the bits of info we do have & this is the result
(this is the website for the completee text, as I have edited alot)
efinition
"It is important to note that all the personality disorders are considered to have their onset in late adolescence or early adulthood. -"
"NPD is defined more specifically as a pattern of grandiosity (exaggerated claims to talents, importance, or specialness) in the patient's private fantasies or outward behavior; a need for constant admiration from others; and a lack of empathy for others-"
Jack: don't know for first two - were he to have written letter(s) or graffito, then 'yes'. publicity in the press, talking in the street, could be construed by him as 'admiration'. 'lack of empathy' -yesHutch: first two apply. Whether lying to police or not, general attitude of attention seeking. Toppy : inflated importance by putting himself into the same frame as 'the Royal Family or Randolph Churchill'. Boasting connotation to the claim that he received money for the case, but constructed needless mystery about exactly why.Description
"A good place to begin a discussion of the different theories about narcissism is with the observation that NPD exists as a diagnostic category only in DSM-IV-TR , which is an American diagnostic manual." .".DSM-IV-TR specifies nine diagnostic criteria for NPD. For the clinician to make the diagnosis, an individual must fit five or more of the following descriptions:
He or she has a grandiose sense of self-importance (exaggerates accomplishments and demands to be considered superior without real evidence of achievement).
Jack: considers that he has God-like right to decide life or death
Hutch : lies or exaggerates witness statement
Toppy: sticks cane out to trip future wife in a theatre when she is coming off stage.
He or she lives in a dream world of exceptional success, power, beauty, genius, or "perfect" love.
He or she thinks of him- or herself as "special" or privileged, and that he or she can only be understood by other special or high-status people.
Jack: any letters or the graffito or possibly 'in' jokes, that were a message to the police and/or 'special people'.
He or she demands excessive amounts of praise or admiration from others.
Jack: mutilations and daring are very attention seeking (-attention could be translated as admiration).
Hutch: parading about town and talking to press is attention seeking(ditto)
Toppy: even if rejected by woman, tripping actress in crowded theatre will attract public
attention and catcalls(ditto)He or she feels entitled to automatic deference, compliance , or favorable treatment from others.
He or she is exploitative towards others and takes advantage of them. Jack: obviously uses victims for self gratification.
Hutch: uses police and press for own advantage
He or she lacks empathy and does not recognize or identify with others' feelings.
Jack : yes
He or she is frequently envious of others or thinks that they are envious of him or her.
He or she "has an attitude" or frequently acts in haughty or arrogant ways.
Jack: takes enormous risks
Hutch: if lying, very arrogant
Toppy: theatre episode is arrogant
In addition to these criteria, DSM-IV-TR groups NPD together with three other personality disorders in its so-called Cluster B. These four disorders are grouped together on the basis of symptom similarities, insofar as patients with these disorders appear to others as overly emotional, unstable, or self-dramatizing. The other three disorders in Cluster B are antisocial, borderline, and histrionic personality disorders.
The DSM-IV-TR clustering system does not mean that all patients can be fitted neatly into one of the three clusters. It is possible for patients to have symptoms of more than one personality disorder or to have symptoms from different clusters. In addition, patients diagnosed with any personality disorder may also meet the criteria for mood, substance abuse, or other disorders.
Subtypes of NPD
AGE GROUP SUBTYPES. Ever since the 1950s, when psychiatrists began to notice an increase in the number of their patients that had narcissistic disorders, they have made attempts to define these disorders more precisely. NPD was introduced as a new diagnostic category in DSM-III , which was published in 1980. Prior to DSM-III , narcissism was a recognized phenomenon but not an official diagnosis. At that time, NPD was considered virtually untreatable because people who suffer from it rarely enter or remain in treatment; typically, they regard themselves as superior to their therapist, and they see their problems as caused by other people's "stupidity" or "lack of appreciation." More recently, however, some psychiatrists have proposed dividing narcissistic patients into two subcategories based roughly on age: those who suffer from the stable form of NPD described by DSM-IVTR , and younger adults whose narcissism is often corrected by life experiences.
This age group distinction represents an ongoing controversy about the nature of NPD—whether it is fundamentally a character disorder, or whether it is a matter of learned behavior that can be unlearned. Therapists who incline toward the first viewpoint are usually pessimistic about the results of treatment for patients with NPD.
PERSONALITY SUBTYPES. Other psychiatrists have noted that patients who meet the DSM-IV-TR criteria for NPD reflect different clusters of traits within the DSM-IV-TR list. One expert in the field of NPD has suggested the following subcategories of narcissistic personalities:
Craving narcissists. These are people who feel emotionally needy and undernourished, and may well appear clingy or demanding to those around them.
Paranoid narcissists. This type of narcissist feels intense contempt for him- or herself, but projects it outward onto others. Paranoid narcissists frequently drive other people away from them by hypercritical and jealous comments and behaviors. Jack: probably jealous and hypercritical of jews
Manipulative narcissists. These people enjoy "putting something over" on others, obtaining their feelings of superiority by lying to and manipulating them.
Jack: obviously 'yes'Hutch: most certainly lied, and manipulated police, press and public
Toppy: most certainly lied about Royal Family & Churchill to son
Phallic narcissists. Almost all narcissists in this subgroup are male. They tend to be aggressive, athletic, and exhibitionistic; they enjoy showing off their bodies, clothes, and overall "manliness."
Causes and symptoms
Causes
"At present there are two major theories about the origin and nature of NPD. One theory regards NPD as a form of arrested psychological development while the other regards it as a young child's defense against psychological pain. The two perspectives have been identified with two major figures in psychoanalytic thought, Heinz Kohut and Otto Kernberg respectively-"
CAUSES IN THE FAMILY OF ORIGIN. Kohut and Kernberg agree with Freud in tracing the roots of NPD to disturbances in the patient's family of origin—specifically, to problems in the parent-child relationship before the child turned three. Where they disagree is in their accounts of the nature of these problems. According to Kohut, the child grows out of primary narcissism through opportunities to be mirrored by (i.e., gain approval from) his or her parents and to idealize them, acquiring a more realistic sense of self and a set of personal ideals and values through these two processes. On the other hand, if the parents fail to provide appropriate opportunities for idealization and mirroring, the child remains "stuck" at a developmental stage in which his or her sense of self remains grandiose and unrealistic while at the same time he or she remains dependent on approval from others for self-esteem.
In contrast, Kernberg views NPD as rooted in the child's defense against a cold and unempathetic parent, usually the mother. Emotionally hungry and angry at the depriving parents, the child withdraws into a part of the self that the parents value, whether looks, intellectual ability, or some other skill or talent. This part of the self becomes hyperinflated and grandiose. Any perceived weaknesses are "split off" into a hidden part of the self. Splitting gives rise to a lifelong tendency to swing between extremes of grandiosity and feelings of emptiness and worthlessness.
NB nothing is known about Jack nor Hutch's early childhood. Toppy lost his mother early (?). We know that he was musical & liked ice skating, later in life, and he chose a theatrical wife. Could very masculine pursuits have been more admired by his father ?? Was there some sort of 'religious mania' ?In both accounts, the child emerges into adult life with a history of unsatisfactory relationships with others. The adult narcissist possesses a grandiose view of the self but has a conflict-ridden psychological dependence on others. At present, however, psychiatrists do not agree in their description of the central defect in NPD; some think that the problem is primarily emotional while others regard it as the result of distorted cognition, or knowing. Some maintain that the person with NPD has an "empty" or hungry sense of self while others argue that the narcissist has a "disorganized" self. Still others regard the core problem as the narcissist's inability to test reality and construct an accurate view of him- or herself.
treatment of families in which the children are replicating the narcissistic disorders of their parents.
Symptoms
Most observers regard grandiosity as the most important single trait of a narcissistic personality. It is important to note that grandiosity implies more than boasting or prideful display as such—it signifies self-aggrandizement that is not borne out by reality. For example, a person who claims that he or she was the most valuable player on a college athletic team may be telling the truth about their undergraduate sports record. Their claim may be bad manners but is not grandiosity. On the other hand, someone who makes the same claim but had an undistinguished record or never even made the team is being grandiose(Hutch; Yes Toppy: Yes) Grandiosity in NPD is related to some of the diagnostic criteria listed by DSM-IV-TR , such as demanding special favors from others or choosing friends and associates on the basis of prestige and high status rather than personal qualities. In addition, grandiosity complicates diagnostic assessment of narcissists because it frequently leads to lying and misrepresentation of one's past history and present accomplishments.
Other symptoms of NPD include:
a history of intense but short-term relationships with others; inability to make or sustain genuinely intimate relationships
a tendency to be attracted to leadership or high-profile positions or occupations
a pattern of alternating between unrealistic idealization of others and equally unrealistic devaluation of them
assessment of others in terms of usefulness
a need to be the center of attention or admiration in a working group or social situation
hypersensitivity to criticism, however mild, or rejection from others
an unstable view of the self that fluctuates between extremes of self-praise and self-contempt
preoccupation with outward appearance, "image," or public opinion rather than inner reality
painful emotions based on shame (dislike of who one is) rather than guilt (regret for what one has done)
People diagnosed with NPD represent a range of levels of functioning. Otto Kernberg has described three levels of narcissistic impairment. At the top are those who are talented or gifted enough to attract all the admiration and attention that they want (Toppy got to be self employed plumber from lowly background) these people may never enter therapy because they don't feel the need. On the second level are those who function satisfactorily in their jobs but seek professional help because they cannot form healthy relationships or because they feel generally bored and aimless. Narcissists on the lowest level have frequently been diagnosed with another mental disorder and/or have gotten into trouble with the law. They often have severe difficulties with anxiety and with controlling their impulses.
Demographics
DSM-IV-TR states that 2% to 16% of the clinical population and slightly less than 1% of the general population of the United States suffers from NPD. Between 50% and 75% of those diagnosed with NPD are males. Little is known about the prevalence of NPD across racial and ethnic groups.
Gender issues
The high preponderance of male patients in studies of narcissism has prompted researchers to explore the effects of gender roles on this particular personality disorder. Some have speculated that the gender imbalance in NPD results from society's disapproval of self-centered and exploitative behavior in women, who are typically socialized to nurture, please, and generally focus their attention on others. Others have remarked that the imbalance is more apparent than real, and that it reflects a basically sexist definition of narcissism. These researchers suggest that definitions of the disorder should be rewritten in future editions of DSM to account for ways in which narcissistic personality traits manifest differently in men and in women.
Professional and leadership positions
One important aspect of NPD that should be noted is that it does not prevent people from occupying, as well as aspiring to, positions of power, wealth, and prestige. Many people with NPD, as Kernberg's classification makes clear, are sufficiently talented to secure the credentials of success. In addition, narcissists' preoccupation with a well-packaged exterior means that they often develop an attractive and persuasive social manner. Many high-functioning narcissists are well liked by casual acquaintances and business associates who never get close enough to notice the emptiness or anger underneath the polished surface.
Unfortunately, narcissists in positions of high visibility or power—particularly in the so-called helping professions (medicine, education, and the ministry)—often do great harm to others. In recent years a number of books and articles have been published within the religious, medical, and business communities regarding the problems caused by professionals with NPD. One psychiatrist noted in a lecture on substance abuse among physicians that NPD is one of the three most common psychiatric diagnoses among physicians in court-mandated substance abuse programs. A psychologist who serves as a consultant in the evaluation of seminary students and ordained clergy has remarked that the proportion of narcissists in the clergy has risen dramatically since the 1960s. Researchers in the field of business organization and management styles have compiled data on the human and economic costs of executives with undiagnosed NPD.
Diagnosis
The diagnosis of NPD is complicated by a number of factors.
Complications of diagnosis
NPD is difficult to diagnose for several reasons. First, some people with NPD function sufficiently well that they do not come to the attention of therapists. Second, narcissists are prone to lie about themselves; thus it may take a long time for a therapist to notice discrepancies between a patient's version of his or her life and information gained from others or from public records. Third, many traits and behaviors associated with NPD may be attributed to other mental disorders. Low functioning narcissists are often diagnosed as having borderline personality disorder (BPD), particularly if they are female; if they are male, they may be diagnosed as having antisocial personality disorder (ASPD).
was suffering from a Narssistic Personality Disorder. It rang true to me, so I had a go at ticking off some boxes as a 'bit of fun'.
It doesn't prove anything at all of course, as we have so little info to go on in the case of Hutch and/or Toppy, but I had a go at playing around with the bits of info we do have & this is the result
(this is the website for the completee text, as I have edited alot)
efinition "It is important to note that all the personality disorders are considered to have their onset in late adolescence or early adulthood. -"
"NPD is defined more specifically as a pattern of grandiosity (exaggerated claims to talents, importance, or specialness) in the patient's private fantasies or outward behavior; a need for constant admiration from others; and a lack of empathy for others-"
Jack: don't know for first two - were he to have written letter(s) or graffito, then 'yes'. publicity in the press, talking in the street, could be construed by him as 'admiration'. 'lack of empathy' -yesHutch: first two apply. Whether lying to police or not, general attitude of attention seeking. Toppy : inflated importance by putting himself into the same frame as 'the Royal Family or Randolph Churchill'. Boasting connotation to the claim that he received money for the case, but constructed needless mystery about exactly why.Description
"A good place to begin a discussion of the different theories about narcissism is with the observation that NPD exists as a diagnostic category only in DSM-IV-TR , which is an American diagnostic manual." .".DSM-IV-TR specifies nine diagnostic criteria for NPD. For the clinician to make the diagnosis, an individual must fit five or more of the following descriptions:
He or she has a grandiose sense of self-importance (exaggerates accomplishments and demands to be considered superior without real evidence of achievement).
Jack: considers that he has God-like right to decide life or death
Hutch : lies or exaggerates witness statement
Toppy: sticks cane out to trip future wife in a theatre when she is coming off stage.
He or she lives in a dream world of exceptional success, power, beauty, genius, or "perfect" love.
He or she thinks of him- or herself as "special" or privileged, and that he or she can only be understood by other special or high-status people.
Jack: any letters or the graffito or possibly 'in' jokes, that were a message to the police and/or 'special people'.
He or she demands excessive amounts of praise or admiration from others.
Jack: mutilations and daring are very attention seeking (-attention could be translated as admiration).
Hutch: parading about town and talking to press is attention seeking(ditto)
Toppy: even if rejected by woman, tripping actress in crowded theatre will attract public
attention and catcalls(ditto)He or she feels entitled to automatic deference, compliance , or favorable treatment from others.
He or she is exploitative towards others and takes advantage of them. Jack: obviously uses victims for self gratification.
Hutch: uses police and press for own advantage
He or she lacks empathy and does not recognize or identify with others' feelings.
Jack : yes
He or she is frequently envious of others or thinks that they are envious of him or her.
He or she "has an attitude" or frequently acts in haughty or arrogant ways.
Jack: takes enormous risks
Hutch: if lying, very arrogant
Toppy: theatre episode is arrogant
In addition to these criteria, DSM-IV-TR groups NPD together with three other personality disorders in its so-called Cluster B. These four disorders are grouped together on the basis of symptom similarities, insofar as patients with these disorders appear to others as overly emotional, unstable, or self-dramatizing. The other three disorders in Cluster B are antisocial, borderline, and histrionic personality disorders.
The DSM-IV-TR clustering system does not mean that all patients can be fitted neatly into one of the three clusters. It is possible for patients to have symptoms of more than one personality disorder or to have symptoms from different clusters. In addition, patients diagnosed with any personality disorder may also meet the criteria for mood, substance abuse, or other disorders.
Subtypes of NPD
AGE GROUP SUBTYPES. Ever since the 1950s, when psychiatrists began to notice an increase in the number of their patients that had narcissistic disorders, they have made attempts to define these disorders more precisely. NPD was introduced as a new diagnostic category in DSM-III , which was published in 1980. Prior to DSM-III , narcissism was a recognized phenomenon but not an official diagnosis. At that time, NPD was considered virtually untreatable because people who suffer from it rarely enter or remain in treatment; typically, they regard themselves as superior to their therapist, and they see their problems as caused by other people's "stupidity" or "lack of appreciation." More recently, however, some psychiatrists have proposed dividing narcissistic patients into two subcategories based roughly on age: those who suffer from the stable form of NPD described by DSM-IVTR , and younger adults whose narcissism is often corrected by life experiences.
This age group distinction represents an ongoing controversy about the nature of NPD—whether it is fundamentally a character disorder, or whether it is a matter of learned behavior that can be unlearned. Therapists who incline toward the first viewpoint are usually pessimistic about the results of treatment for patients with NPD.
PERSONALITY SUBTYPES. Other psychiatrists have noted that patients who meet the DSM-IV-TR criteria for NPD reflect different clusters of traits within the DSM-IV-TR list. One expert in the field of NPD has suggested the following subcategories of narcissistic personalities:
Craving narcissists. These are people who feel emotionally needy and undernourished, and may well appear clingy or demanding to those around them.
Paranoid narcissists. This type of narcissist feels intense contempt for him- or herself, but projects it outward onto others. Paranoid narcissists frequently drive other people away from them by hypercritical and jealous comments and behaviors. Jack: probably jealous and hypercritical of jews
Manipulative narcissists. These people enjoy "putting something over" on others, obtaining their feelings of superiority by lying to and manipulating them.
Jack: obviously 'yes'Hutch: most certainly lied, and manipulated police, press and public
Toppy: most certainly lied about Royal Family & Churchill to son
Phallic narcissists. Almost all narcissists in this subgroup are male. They tend to be aggressive, athletic, and exhibitionistic; they enjoy showing off their bodies, clothes, and overall "manliness."
Causes and symptoms
Causes
"At present there are two major theories about the origin and nature of NPD. One theory regards NPD as a form of arrested psychological development while the other regards it as a young child's defense against psychological pain. The two perspectives have been identified with two major figures in psychoanalytic thought, Heinz Kohut and Otto Kernberg respectively-"
CAUSES IN THE FAMILY OF ORIGIN. Kohut and Kernberg agree with Freud in tracing the roots of NPD to disturbances in the patient's family of origin—specifically, to problems in the parent-child relationship before the child turned three. Where they disagree is in their accounts of the nature of these problems. According to Kohut, the child grows out of primary narcissism through opportunities to be mirrored by (i.e., gain approval from) his or her parents and to idealize them, acquiring a more realistic sense of self and a set of personal ideals and values through these two processes. On the other hand, if the parents fail to provide appropriate opportunities for idealization and mirroring, the child remains "stuck" at a developmental stage in which his or her sense of self remains grandiose and unrealistic while at the same time he or she remains dependent on approval from others for self-esteem.
In contrast, Kernberg views NPD as rooted in the child's defense against a cold and unempathetic parent, usually the mother. Emotionally hungry and angry at the depriving parents, the child withdraws into a part of the self that the parents value, whether looks, intellectual ability, or some other skill or talent. This part of the self becomes hyperinflated and grandiose. Any perceived weaknesses are "split off" into a hidden part of the self. Splitting gives rise to a lifelong tendency to swing between extremes of grandiosity and feelings of emptiness and worthlessness.
NB nothing is known about Jack nor Hutch's early childhood. Toppy lost his mother early (?). We know that he was musical & liked ice skating, later in life, and he chose a theatrical wife. Could very masculine pursuits have been more admired by his father ?? Was there some sort of 'religious mania' ?In both accounts, the child emerges into adult life with a history of unsatisfactory relationships with others. The adult narcissist possesses a grandiose view of the self but has a conflict-ridden psychological dependence on others. At present, however, psychiatrists do not agree in their description of the central defect in NPD; some think that the problem is primarily emotional while others regard it as the result of distorted cognition, or knowing. Some maintain that the person with NPD has an "empty" or hungry sense of self while others argue that the narcissist has a "disorganized" self. Still others regard the core problem as the narcissist's inability to test reality and construct an accurate view of him- or herself.
treatment of families in which the children are replicating the narcissistic disorders of their parents.
Symptoms
Most observers regard grandiosity as the most important single trait of a narcissistic personality. It is important to note that grandiosity implies more than boasting or prideful display as such—it signifies self-aggrandizement that is not borne out by reality. For example, a person who claims that he or she was the most valuable player on a college athletic team may be telling the truth about their undergraduate sports record. Their claim may be bad manners but is not grandiosity. On the other hand, someone who makes the same claim but had an undistinguished record or never even made the team is being grandiose(Hutch; Yes Toppy: Yes) Grandiosity in NPD is related to some of the diagnostic criteria listed by DSM-IV-TR , such as demanding special favors from others or choosing friends and associates on the basis of prestige and high status rather than personal qualities. In addition, grandiosity complicates diagnostic assessment of narcissists because it frequently leads to lying and misrepresentation of one's past history and present accomplishments.
Other symptoms of NPD include:
a history of intense but short-term relationships with others; inability to make or sustain genuinely intimate relationships
a tendency to be attracted to leadership or high-profile positions or occupations
a pattern of alternating between unrealistic idealization of others and equally unrealistic devaluation of them
assessment of others in terms of usefulness
a need to be the center of attention or admiration in a working group or social situation
hypersensitivity to criticism, however mild, or rejection from others
an unstable view of the self that fluctuates between extremes of self-praise and self-contempt
preoccupation with outward appearance, "image," or public opinion rather than inner reality
painful emotions based on shame (dislike of who one is) rather than guilt (regret for what one has done)
People diagnosed with NPD represent a range of levels of functioning. Otto Kernberg has described three levels of narcissistic impairment. At the top are those who are talented or gifted enough to attract all the admiration and attention that they want (Toppy got to be self employed plumber from lowly background) these people may never enter therapy because they don't feel the need. On the second level are those who function satisfactorily in their jobs but seek professional help because they cannot form healthy relationships or because they feel generally bored and aimless. Narcissists on the lowest level have frequently been diagnosed with another mental disorder and/or have gotten into trouble with the law. They often have severe difficulties with anxiety and with controlling their impulses.
Demographics
DSM-IV-TR states that 2% to 16% of the clinical population and slightly less than 1% of the general population of the United States suffers from NPD. Between 50% and 75% of those diagnosed with NPD are males. Little is known about the prevalence of NPD across racial and ethnic groups.
Gender issues
The high preponderance of male patients in studies of narcissism has prompted researchers to explore the effects of gender roles on this particular personality disorder. Some have speculated that the gender imbalance in NPD results from society's disapproval of self-centered and exploitative behavior in women, who are typically socialized to nurture, please, and generally focus their attention on others. Others have remarked that the imbalance is more apparent than real, and that it reflects a basically sexist definition of narcissism. These researchers suggest that definitions of the disorder should be rewritten in future editions of DSM to account for ways in which narcissistic personality traits manifest differently in men and in women.
Professional and leadership positions
One important aspect of NPD that should be noted is that it does not prevent people from occupying, as well as aspiring to, positions of power, wealth, and prestige. Many people with NPD, as Kernberg's classification makes clear, are sufficiently talented to secure the credentials of success. In addition, narcissists' preoccupation with a well-packaged exterior means that they often develop an attractive and persuasive social manner. Many high-functioning narcissists are well liked by casual acquaintances and business associates who never get close enough to notice the emptiness or anger underneath the polished surface.
Unfortunately, narcissists in positions of high visibility or power—particularly in the so-called helping professions (medicine, education, and the ministry)—often do great harm to others. In recent years a number of books and articles have been published within the religious, medical, and business communities regarding the problems caused by professionals with NPD. One psychiatrist noted in a lecture on substance abuse among physicians that NPD is one of the three most common psychiatric diagnoses among physicians in court-mandated substance abuse programs. A psychologist who serves as a consultant in the evaluation of seminary students and ordained clergy has remarked that the proportion of narcissists in the clergy has risen dramatically since the 1960s. Researchers in the field of business organization and management styles have compiled data on the human and economic costs of executives with undiagnosed NPD.
Diagnosis
The diagnosis of NPD is complicated by a number of factors.
Complications of diagnosis
NPD is difficult to diagnose for several reasons. First, some people with NPD function sufficiently well that they do not come to the attention of therapists. Second, narcissists are prone to lie about themselves; thus it may take a long time for a therapist to notice discrepancies between a patient's version of his or her life and information gained from others or from public records. Third, many traits and behaviors associated with NPD may be attributed to other mental disorders. Low functioning narcissists are often diagnosed as having borderline personality disorder (BPD), particularly if they are female; if they are male, they may be diagnosed as having antisocial personality disorder (ASPD).