Ripper Timidity?

[Mascara & Paranoia]

I don't think he was especially brainy or above average in intelligence. He may have went to school as a kid but I really doubt he would've attended Uni or went to college (assuming they had those back then). Apart from how he sliced Annie open there's not one thing that indicates to him being skilled or intelligent in any way other than you're average person.

Slash, open up, lift out stuff, hack something out, brisk walk away. It's not exactly rocket science.

[lynn cates]

brains

Hello. Quite true that mutilation is not difficult. But is your average person capable of such a mind set? I live amongst scholars and, believe me, if anyone is capable of the "melancholy madness" or sexual problems likely associated with the Ripper, it is a scholar.

I had a colleague in graduate school who threatened to dedicate his life to destroying his professor's research, unless his demands were met.

Your average person gets off work, goes to the pub, has a pint, and goes home. If you make him angry he'll snap at you or call you a bad name and it's all forgotten.

That's why I can't believe in the 3 K's (Klosowski, Kaminski, Kosminski) as Ripper. They seem not to have exhibited sufficient neuronal involvement to lead to a complex personality--just violent (at least the first 2) behavior at a simple level.

LC

[Jeff Leahy]

On the whole schizophrenics are high achievers. On set of the disease is typically late teens to 22 years of age. Which is why a high proportion are graduates.

I’m not convinced that Kosminski had the chance of college.

Pirate

[Sam Flynn]

I’m not convinced that Kosminski had the chance of college.

Higher/further education back then was still largely confined to the privileged few.

[Mascara & Paranoia]

I’m not convinced that Kosminski had the chance of college.

Slightly off-topic, but wasn't he supposed to be a hairdresser or something? Wouldn't he have had to have trained somewhere? o_O

But anyway.

[Sam Flynn]

Not at a "hairdressers' college", though, M&P. If he trained anywhere at all, it would have been via an apprenticeship to a local barber. Not that even this level of training was required: my great grandfather had a set of clippers with which he'd cut the hair of friends and neighbours for a modest fee (he did so into his late eighties), and he had no formal hairdresser's training at all.

[Mascara & Paranoia]

xD Cheers for clearing that up. I always wondered about Aaron's profession in that respect.

[Jeff Leahy]

I believe that Rob House did some research that suggested that he might have trained in Poland as a Felcher. I can only assume that, if true, it would have taken some study and would suggest that at some point he could read and write.

Pirate

[perrymason]

I think the fact that we do not have one suspect with any kind of tangible suggestive evidence against them tells us that the natural cess pool from which we would have expected him to slither from is probably not where he originated. I dont believe he had any known criminal history, mental illness, public position or any real social life to speak of. I do believe he worked. Likely Monday to Friday, with Holidays off. Thats probably not a poor local man in a lodging house. And its not a homeless man with dementia.

It sounds to me a fair bit like a clerk. Someone in records management for the police maybe, a librarian, an accountant. I dont believe he needed to live within the targetted square mile, and he may have learned the streets and lanes walking to and from work.

That kind of man may not be charismatic, or charming, or witty, or urbane, or terribly interesting to anyone.......and that may be how he slipped under everyones radar.

But timid.....I dont think so. Maybe quiet, anti social with a cool disposition to those around him.

Im no expert, but it seems to me that a killer like Jack has to feel superior to his victims, like he is entitled to do what he does because they are essentially the citys trash that is left to rot on corners. A smug clerk type with the attitude and arrogance of the young Hannibal Lecter character in the prequel.

A charming man with manners and education could work too I suppose....but in these cases that likely means a toff...and that I dont see as Jack.

Cheers all

[Sam Flynn]

I believe that Rob House did some research that suggested that he might have trained in Poland as a Felcher.

Feldsher or feldscher, Jeff... anything but "felcher"

[Sam Flynn]

Back on topic...

To return to the premise of this (suspect-neutral) thread, Pettifogger's original question was:

"Anyone else out there who thinks that JtR was a timid fellow who gave all outward appearances of being a milquetoast?"

[Pablito]

Are we talkking about George Chapman? He either trained to be a Doctor or was a Doctor's apprentice in his home country before he entered the hairdressing trade. People are split as to whether he completed his studies or not. I think Kosminski was just a hairdresser, yeah

Slightly off-topic, but wasn't he supposed to be a hairdresser or something? Wouldn't he have had to have trained somewhere? o_O

But anyway.

[Sam Flynn]

Are we talking about George Chapman?

We were, but that's not the topic of this thread, which is a "General Discussion" one about the timidity (or otherwise) of the Ripper, not specific to any suspect. Chapman/Klosowski has a section of his own on these boards - as does Kosminski and most of the rest

[Pettifogger]

I think the fact that we do not have one suspect with any kind of tangible suggestive evidence against them tells us that the natural cess pool from which we would have expected him to slither from is probably not where he originated. I dont believe he had any known criminal history, mental illness, public position or any real social life to speak of. I do believe he worked. Likely Monday to Friday, with Holidays off. Thats probably not a poor local man in a lodging house. And its not a homeless man with dementia.

It sounds to me a fair bit like a clerk. Someone in records management for the police maybe, a librarian, an accountant. I dont believe he needed to live within the targetted square mile, and he may have learned the streets and lanes walking to and from work.

That kind of man may not be charismatic, or charming, or witty, or urbane, or terribly interesting to anyone.......and that may be how he slipped under everyones radar.

But timid.....I dont think so. Maybe quiet, anti social with a cool disposition to those around him.

Im no expert, but it seems to me that a killer like Jack has to feel superior to his victims, like he is entitled to do what he does because they are essentially the citys trash that is left to rot on corners. A smug clerk type with the attitude and arrogance of the young Hannibal Lecter character in the prequel.

A charming man with manners and education could work too I suppose....but in these cases that likely means a toff...and that I dont see as Jack.

Cheers all

I too follow similar lines of thought...especially someone who was a dilgent record keeper. Compulsive record keeping does seem to be a pattern among all types of serial killers.

I feel the entitlement issue as well since this was someone who felt he never got his due in life. I'm sure that was an undercurrent long before any psychosis began to intrude on his thoughts.

PLEASE NOTE: I'm supporting a belief that he JtR gave all outward appearances of being a milquetoast. Someone nobody was threatened by nor took seriously and simply went unnoticed because of it. Those who knew or worked with him saw JtR as efficient, reliable and eccentric. He most likely spent his lunchtime eating and reading. The library was his home away from home.

[perrymason]

Hi again Pettifogger,

I suppose my "to the point" answer would be that he may have been innocuous. Wallpaper. Lacking any charm or charisma. Socially awkward.

I dont know that for me the translation for the above would be "milquetoast", but something like withdrawn.

He probably handled the tasks we all do quite normally....got his wash done, paid his rent on time, maybe even went to church. Just another hat in a crowd of hats. The type you could live beside for 5 years and not have spoken to.

Cheers Pettifogger