Jack's Punishment

[Ally]

Really? Who was that?

[perrymason]

Really? Who was that?

Hi Ally,

It was in a segment broadcast on Discovery Civilization channel recently, from the Most Evil series hosted by forensic psychologist Michael Stone......but sorry, for the life of me I dont recall the killers name,...his name was MacGonagal, MacGarrick or something to that effect.

I believe he lost a child to street violence and then killed 2 or 3 women in what was referred to as "revenge". He met and fell in love with a woman who met him while he was in jail, and according to Stone made a remarkable transformation as a result, losing the urge to kill and wanting to return to a normal life. After his release they had some issues apparently, and split up....he went to Scotland and she remained in America. Stone had categorized him as very dangerous based on the crime details, but after meeting him, he lowered his "threat rating" on him.

I watch the show regularly and they repeat episodes a lot, next time I catch it Ill get the details down...I was just mildly curious about the story the first time hearing it and didnt log the names or dates as a result.

Best regards Ally.

[Ally]

The only person who fits the criteria of being a serial murderer who was paroled and sent back to scotland and featured on Most Evil that I can find was Archibald McCafferty.

However, he was tried and paroled in Australia, not the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Most_Evil

[DVV]

in Wales it would be public flogging by leek until dead. Same in Scotland but with a thistle.

Hi BB,

In Ethiopia, it would be public flogging too, but with an acacia branch.

In Provence, we use a branch of mimosa.
It takes weeks, you know.

Amitiés,
David

[perrymason]

The only person who fits the criteria of being a serial murderer who was paroled and sent back to scotland and featured on Most Evil that I can find was Archibald McCafferty.

However, he was tried and paroled in Australia, not the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Most_Evil

Then you have found him, and I apologize for the error suggesting he was paroled from the US...as I said I only viewed it with passing interest and I assumed that since my understanding is that Stone only interviewed serial killers in America for the series, that it was done there.

Cheers Ally

[Graham]

Actually, had Jack been caught, there's a good chance he might have been sent to the Funny Farm. In spite of the reputation the Victorians had for rapid and rough justice, on occasion they could be surprisingly enlightened when it came to dealing with obviously crazy criminals. In 1888 there were, I understand, quite a few murderers in Colney Hatch Asylum.

As for James Berry, he was one of the most inept hangmen in relatively modern times. At least one of his jobs resulted in decapitation because the drop was too long, and on at least one other occasion the condemned slowly strangled to death because the drop was too short. He was eventually sacked, I believe. (How about that on your CV - Reason For Dismissal: Bungled Executions!) Even Albert Pierrepoint buggered up at least one hanging.

Berry was the bloke who topped Neal Cream, and it's only Berry's word that Cream said "I am Jack - arrrggh!" as the trap was sprung.

Mind, the number of screwed-up hangings in the UK pales into insignificance compared with the history of screwed-up electrocutions in the USA.

Graham

[quasar]

I am not exactly sure how the laws for punishment were in 1888, if declared sane or insane. When Andrei Chikatilo was caught in 1990, he was declared sane and responsable for his actions, and thus stood trial under normal circumstances. Even so , although he was nearly lynched during his trial (understandably), his sentence was the standard law sentence.He got off very lightly with a simple bullet behind the neck.

If JtR was caught, and declared sane and responsable for his actions, there is no doubt he would have got the default sentence of 1888 - the gallows. That is providing someone did not do a 'Jack Ruby' on him, or he got lynched - which would have been alot worse, and a distinct possibility.

Thanks Q.

[Pippin Joan]

Lets say Jack would have been caught how would he have been sentenced?
would he have been simply hanged?The most likely cruelest and enigmatic killer ever.Im sure compared to other murderer in his time he would have gotten a special execution.

Enigmatic, yes. Of his time, definitely he would have rated a special degree of punishment to satisfy the public. But cruelest? No. There is every evidence that his mutilations were done postmortem, and he took particular care to make sure that the victim died as quickly as possible. Compare this to serial killers who took delight in prolonging the suffering of their victims. Those are the people for whom we can sit back in our easy chairs, and devise suitable lingering retribution. Oh, for the good old days, say, four hundred years ago, for the likes of the Wests.

[YankeeSergeant]

Punishment

Enigmatic, yes. Of his time, definitely he would have rated a special degree of punishment to satisfy the public. But cruelest? No. There is every evidence that his mutilations were done postmortem, and he took particular care to make sure that the victim died as quickly as possible. Compare this to serial killers who took delight in prolonging the suffering of their victims. Those are the people for whom we can sit back in our easy chairs, and devise suitable lingering retribution. Oh, for the good old days, say, four hundred years ago, for the likes of the Wests.

Provided he met the criteria of the day for sanity (M'naghten) he would have recieved a fair trial followed by a first class hanging.

[The Good Michael]

Mind, the number of screwed-up hangings in the UK pales into insignificance compared with the history of screwed-up electrocutions in the USA.

Maybe that's because the US has so many more executions. More executions=more screw-ups.

Mike

Maybe you're referring to the executioner being poor at his job?

Since 1976 there have been 1,243 executions in the States. It is estimated that at least 39 were wrongful executions. I can't find any British stats, but the English have a rich history of executions. It always came with putting a new monarch on the throne. We've never had that problem in America. Voting in a president has always seemed a little better method than family squabbles over who's in line for the crown and the bloodbaths that always followed.

Cheers,

Mike

[The Grave Maurice]

We've never had that problem in America. Voting in a president has always seemed a little better method than family squabbles over who's in line for the crown and the bloodbaths that always followed.

Perhaps. But, compared to presidents, how many British monarchs have been assassinated since 1776?

[The Good Michael]

Perhaps. But, compared to presidents, how many British monarchs have been assassinated since 1776?

Ok, you've got me there. Don't mention the periods from 600 until 1649 or you'll not have a leg to stand on.

Mike

[Christine1932]

Most serial killers are not psychotic and thus they are responsible for their crimes. I believe this was true in case of Jack, too, and thus he would have been hanged.

[Sister Hyde]

Most serial killers are not psychotic and thus they are responsible for their crimes. I believe this was true in case of Jack, too, and thus he would have been hanged.

Yep, psychotic people do realize very well what they are doing, they are definitely conscient of their acts, they just can't help it.

[Hatchett]

Hi,

In those days under the McNaughton rules it was very difficult for a plea of insanity in murder cases to succeed. Part of the problem was the rules themselves, very much like a Catch 22 situation.

Considering that hanging was the only recorgnised legal form of punshiment for murder in 1888, then Jack the Ripper, who ever he was, would in my view have undoubtedly been hanged.

Best wishes.

Hatchett.