Same motive = same killer

[RockySullivan]

What does it mean when they say a thigh and some human flesh? perhaps debs knows?

[Abby Normal]

If you don't know me by know Abby, I have about 40,000 suspects depending on the day. lol

Richard Lawrence was working on the site with Wildbore. He put Wildbores tools away on Saturday and took them back out on Monday morning. He is described by Wilbore as "my laborer". He is the man on Tuesday morning that Wildbore supposedly lit a match and showed the parcel to and then they both went away thinking it was nothing. I feel they could be in cahoots. Both lived in the Battersea area in 1888.

OK thanks!

[Abby Normal]

Abby what thread have you been reading? Lawrence is the other worker who was in the vault on wildbore

I have a bad memory and a little slow on the uptake

[jerryd]

Abby,

I posted this on a different thread awhile back. Even in the day, they thought two men might be responsible. This article also seems to include Jack in on the deed.

The Echo September 16, 1889

[Abby Normal]

Abby,

I posted this on a different thread awhile back. Even in the day, they thought two men might be responsible. This article also seems to include Jack in on the deed.

The Echo September 16, 1889

Interesting Jerry
Have you looked into whether wildbore/Lawrence have any connection to the ripper murders?

[jerryd]

Interesting Jerry
Have you looked into whether wildbore/Lawrence have any connection to the ripper murders?

Other than a Dr. Samuel Wildbore living at 1, Backchurch Lane in the 1860's, I haven't found a connection to Whitechapel yet. Dr. Wildbore had a son born in 1860 named Frederick Wildbore, believe it or not, that died the same year (1860).

I am currently looking into Wildbore's employer, John Grover & Sons, and whether they were doing work in Whitechapel in 1888 other than the new police building. I know in the past J.Grover had a deal wharf in the docks not too far from Pinchin Street.

I've mentioned this before, Gary Barnett found that both men (Wildbore and Lawrence) had fathers that committed suicide. Wildbore's when he was very young. I wanna say when he was about 8 years old. He then went to live with his fathers twin brother, Michael.

[RockySullivan]

Jerry i know we've been I've this before but what was the address the pc was asked to knock up? In forgotten vjctims it says there suspicion this was used to distract pc. I wonder how close the address was to schwartz in ellen

[jerryd]

Jerry i know we've been I've this before but what was the address the pc was asked to knock up? In forgotten vjctims it says there suspicion this was used to distract pc. I wonder how close the address was to schwartz in ellen

The address was in Ellen Place, matter of fact. I believe his name was, Jeremiah Hurley.

[RockySullivan]

The address was in Ellen Place, matter of fact. I believe his name was, Jeremiah Hurley.

Very interesting. I think there might be something there. Thank you

[Fisherman]

On the topic of how one may or may not be sufficiently convinced about something on circumstantial evidence to say that it is enough for making a definitive call, it is interesting to read professor David Wilsons identification of serial killer Peter Tobin as "Bible John":

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/scots-murderer-peter-tobin-is-bible-1061592

Wilson says:

"I didn't set out to prove Tobin was Bible John but I would stake my professional reputation on it."

and it is said that "The criminologist accepts there may never be definitive proof that Tobin is the infamous serial killer but he added: ´I am as convinced as it's able to be. As far as I am concerned the case is closed´"

Wilson primarily bases his take on things on how Tobin expressed himself in a conversation, and on how he has used an alias that closely resembles a name that was given by "Bible John" back in the sixties.

I think Wilson may very well be right, and I would stretch myself to a verdict of him very probably being correct.

I would, however, say that I think that Wilsons case is not as good as the case for a shared identity between the Ripper and the Torso killer is. There is physical evidence in the latter case of a very specific character that is lacking in the Tobin/Bible John comparison.

It is nice to know that people who are very high-ranking in terms of knowledge of serial killers are prepared to make calls like these on circumstantial evidence. And I for one would not say "So much for objectivity" - I would say that the accusation Wilson makes is a very objective one, grounded in existing evidence of a very poignant character, and I would add that this is precisely how cold cases can be solved: by looking closely at the detials of the crimes, and identifying parameters that are, as Abby puts it, above and beyond resonable doubt.

And od course, what Wilson says is what I say too, but instead about the shared identity of the Ripper and the Torso killer: I am as convinced as it´s able to be, and as far as I´m concerned it´s case closed.

[Abby Normal]

On the topic of how one may or may not be sufficiently convinced about something on circumstantial evidence to say that it is enough for making a definitive call, it is interesting to read professor David Wilsons identification of serial killer Peter Tobin as "Bible John":

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/scots-murderer-peter-tobin-is-bible-1061592

Wilson says:

"I didn't set out to prove Tobin was Bible John but I would stake my professional reputation on it."

and it is said that "The criminologist accepts there may never be definitive proof that Tobin is the infamous serial killer but he added: ´I am as convinced as it's able to be. As far as I am concerned the case is closed´"

Wilson primarily bases his take on things on how Tobin expressed himself in a conversation, and on how he has used an alias that closely resembles a name that was given by "Bible John" back in the sixties.

I think Wilson may very well be right, and I would stretch myself to a verdict of him very probably being correct.

I would, however, say that I think that Wilsons case is not as good as the case for a shared identity between the Ripper and the Torso killer is. There is physical evidence in the latter case of a very specific character that is lacking in the Tobin/Bible John comparison.

It is nice to know that people who are very high-ranking in terms of knowledge of serial killers are prepared to make calls like these on circumstantial evidence. And I for one would not say "So much for objectivity" - I would say that the accusation Wilson makes is a very objective one, grounded in existing evidence of a very poignant character, and I would add that this is precisely how cold cases can be solved: by looking closely at the detials of the crimes, and identifying parameters that are, as Abby puts it, above and beyond resonable doubt.

And od course, what Wilson says is what I say too, but instead about the shared identity of the Ripper and the Torso killer: I am as convinced as it´s able to be, and as far as I´m concerned it´s case closed.

tobin cant be Bible John, because the majority of his victims were found in a different location than the bible john series! ; )

[Fisherman]

tobin cant be Bible John, because the majority of his victims were found in a different location than the bible john series! ; )

Sod it - has anybody told Wilson...?

[RockySullivan]

how much was schwartz paid for his story to the star?

[Sam Flynn]

tobin cant be Bible John, because the majority of his victims were found in a different location than the bible john series! ; )

Great invention, the car.

[Abby Normal]

Great invention, the car.

great invention, the cart