The GSG - Did Jack write it? POLL

[Jane Welland]

Hello Michael and Pirate Jack..

I don't say it means I must be right, I don't think I'm qualified to say so just yet! - but it just seems to me to be asking a bit much of co-incidence? Whilst accepting it could be, I tend to lean towards the thought that all three events are interconnected, personally.

Jane x

[perrymason]

Blimmey Michael thats confusing..

are you saying 'whoever wrote the Graffiti' killed Stride and Eddowes?

Which your last post would seem to imply

Pirate

Hi Pirate,

What I was saying is that I believe its possible that Jack the Ripper didnt kill Liz Stride, but did kill Kate Eddowes. I think he took his "take" from Kate somewhere to store it and came back out to put the apron somewhere. I think he decided to suggest that the men at Berner Street were evading responsibility for Strides murder, and Jack felt that they were probably the real guilty party. I wonder if the Model Homes housed any International Club members.

Of the 2 physical pieces of evidence that exists from the Double Event, the apron section, and the section of kidney that was possibly Kates later sent to Lusk....neither has any connection or reference to the earlier murder.

But I think the GSG does.

Cheers mate

[The Good Michael]

Of the 2 physical pieces of evidence that exists from the Double Event, the apron section, and the section of kidney that was possibly Kates later sent to Lusk....neither has any connection or reference to the earlier murder.

Michael,

Unfair. If he had time, maybe he would have had something to connect. Also, we don't know that he didn't take something from Stride to leave at Eddowes scene. It's entirely possible.

Cheersm

Mike

[Nothing to see]

Why the hell would he? He's murdered. He's out of there. He's headed for wherever. Why would he pull a piece of chalk out of his pocket and start writing cryptic crap? Jack was a busy boy. Goulston St wasn't Jack.

[Fisherman]

Mike (the good one) writes:

"we don't know that he didn't take something from Stride to leave at Eddowes scene. It's entirely possible."

So, Mike, he just happened to pass by Dutfields yard where Stride lay dead, and popped in to take something from her and brought it with him to Mitre Square - and nobody saw it happen?

How odd!

Fisherman
slightly provocative - ever so slightly...!

[The Good Michael]

Fish,

If it was the Ripper that killed both of them, he could have taken something from Stride for all we know to leave at the next victim's scene.

That's odd? I think not.

Mike

[Fisherman]

It would only be odd, Mike, if he did NOT kill Stride, but even so made a beeline for Dutfields yard to bring some of her belongings with him to Mitre Square - whis was what I suggested ...

The best,
Fisherman

[The Good Michael]

Fish,

Understood, but that was not in any way what I suggested.

Mike

[Fisherman]

Iīm quite aware of that, Mike - but why would I let trivialities like that stop me from making the point that I donīt think Stride was one of Jackīs...?

The best,
Fisherman

[Steve F]

What about this?

Maybe he did take parts from all the murders...and ate them all

[The Good Michael]

Iīm quite aware of that, Mike - but why would I let trivialities like that stop me from making the point that I donīt think Stride was one of Jackīs...?

Because this is isn't the place for that and I'm reminded of how Hutchinson crops up everywhere when it usually isn't the place for agenda. Just keep that in mind please.

Cheers,

Mike

[perrymason]

Hi Folks,

Mike and Fisherman,...no point in beating this to death because there is no way to know if he took anything (physical property) from any other victim with the intention of then discarding it. He took Annies rings,....and he took the apron section....all we know is that he discarded one of those 2 items.

This situation has many possible answers;

-The apron was discarded casually and without connection to the writing, or even knowledge of it
-The apron was intentionally left near some pre-existing grafitti
-The apron was placed in close proximity to a message the carrier wrote himself.

And one less travelled road,

-The message was written by the carrier of the apron before the killing or killings

The question that affects all of the above, is whether the cloth was left before 2:10am, or after it.

I believe its probable it was left after, its the only one of the two answers that logically corroborates the PC's statement, and that makes anything even remotely suggestive about the apron section crime scene potentially premeditated.

Best regards all.

[Archaic]

The Goulston Street Ink-Blot Test

[QUOTE=Mascara & Paranoia;70810
I don't think Jack was Jewish, against Jewish people or was motivated in that way, but (assuming the PC who stumbled upon it didn't just miss it being there the first time round) it's a major coincidence that it then turns up at the same point as Eddowes' apron, shortly after Jack (assuming the man Lawende saw was the Ripper with Eddowes) had been witnessed by three Jews and apparently murdered another prostitute outside a Jewish club an hour or so before (I can't remember exact timing). It's more likely than not his handiwork but I'm not totally convinced.[/QUOTE]

I think these are good points, Paranoia. Might I add the shouted epithet "Lipski!" to your list of coincidences? The divergence of opinion on this topic is quite interesting.

Personally, I don't feel the Graffito itself is terribly useful as "evidence" because due to its extremely ambiguous nature, disputes about its wording, the uncertain circumstances of its discovery, and the lack of any photographic record, it's become a sort of uber-Rorshach Ink Blot Test that can be endorsed or discarded to suit any theory.

I don't know if Jack wrote it, but I think it's more likely that he did than that he ran thru Whitechapel, fleeing 2 murders, reading random graffiti in the dark as he went, and then picked an existent graffito to drop the apron near. Of course, it could have been just total coincidence, & maybe some unknown Whitechapel resident had wandered around the neighborhood chalking nonsensical cryptic messages on the walls. I doubt we'll ever know.

But IF Jack wrote it, he could even have done so at the start of the evening, right? BEFORE he had killed anyone. We always assume it was written afterward, but that doesn't have to be true; it's merely an assumption. Because it seems so logical, it's very easy to forget that it's an assumption.

The odd wording and structure of the Graffito renders it utterly nonsensical as an English Language sentence (double negatives separated by an infinitive are an English Major's worst nightmare!) So I suspect this could well have been a private word-game deliberately created for the fun of baffling everybody & making them try to figure it out.
I do think Jack got a big kick out of watching news reports, public opinion & the police investigation itself go off in mistaken directions.

I feel that IF Jack wrote the Graffito AND/OR deliberately chose the location of the "Juwes" Graffito as the vicinity in which to discard Eddowe's apron, he did so because he got some kind of personal 'jolly' out of planting a huge red herring & baffling everybody.
And if that's true, it kind of bugs me to think that Jack's funny little game has succeeded beyond his wildest dreams. Because even though he's dead, I hate to give him the satisfaction.
Best regards, Archaic

[perrymason]

But IF Jack wrote it, he could even have done so at the start of the evening, right? BEFORE he had killed anyone. We always assume it was written afterward, but that doesn't have to be true; it's merely an assumption. Because it seems so logical, it's very easy to forget that it's an assumption.

Best regards, Archaic

Didnt I just post that same suggestion in the immediately preceding post? I just found it interesting that you mention it as some new concept in the very next post.

"And one less traveled road, -The message was written by the carrier of the apron before the killing or killings"

Cheers Archaic

[Celesta]

.

This situation has many possible answers;

-The apron was discarded casually and without connection to the writing, or even knowledge of it
-The apron was intentionally left near some pre-existing grafitti
-The apron was placed in close proximity to a message the carrier wrote himself.

.

Or the dude lived in the building and dropped it there. When he realized his mistake, it was too late to do anything about it. Yes, I know....but it is a possibility. I admit I know almost nothing about who actually lived in the building though.