The GSG - Did Jack write it? POLL

[Varqm]

Maybe re-phrase the question, would it be easier to understand the GSG if it were written by an innocent writer or the killer.

[DJA]

Sam I'm 50 years old and I've been all over the world, in big cities, little towns, suburbs, country and wilderness.

It's never been pitch black any where.

Except in the few caves I've been in or completely closed off rooms.

The darkest place outside I've ever been is in deep woods camping many times, and it's still never been pitch black. It's physically impossible.

You just weren't looking

Up here you get starry,starry nights and pitch black.

Used to love bush walking at night,however there were times I simply had to stop on a track and pull out a small pocket torch.

Last night you could not walk around my house block without a flashlight.
There is a HP sodium lamp 300 metres away.

[DJA]

We seem to be going in circles.

Welcome to Casebook

[The Good Michael]

You just weren't looking

Up here you get starry,starry nights and pitch black.

Used to love bush walking at night,however there were times I simply had to stop on a track and pull out a small pocket torch.

Last night you could not walk around my house block without a flashlight.
There is a HP sodium lamp 300 metres away.

I believe this is all a build-up by Abby for when he theorizes the killer was a lemur.

I was just up on the northern spit of land on Magong, Penghu, and I could barely see the ripples on the ocean. No round schoolboy's hand for me last night.

Mike

[DJA]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0EjvGoV9bc

[John G]

Folks
Are we really trying to argue it was absolutely pitch black in goulston street so the graffiti couldn't have been written at night? Really!?!

if it was pitch black there it must be pitch black in so many other places in London at night you would wonder how anybody could get around. Cmon. There's enough ambient lighting from the other lights and the moon and the overall reflection of lights in the city and reflecting off the clouds that you could see.

Nowhere would it be pitch black except in rooms with doors closed and curtains drawn.

And besides, he could have struck a match. And even if it was pitch black it's still possible to write even if you can't see. Especially if it was cursive or semi cursive.

One of the weakest arguments I've seen on here in a while.

It was pitch black in Dutfield's Yard. We know this because Lave couldn't even see the door to let himself back into the club.

It's therefore likely that the passage was even darker, i.e because it was narrower and enclosed on three sides. Then there's the testimony of PC Long in which he states he couldn't even see the wall, let alone the writing, without his bullseye lamp.

You cannot just ignore all this contemporary evidence. And trying to make comparisons with light-polluted 2017 isn't helpful.

And don't forget, it not only has to be legible to write but write leigibly.

Lighting matches would have been a crazy idea. For a start, as I noted in my earlier post, have had to light around 10 matches. And considering white phosphorus matches were chemically similar to napalm, and burned ferociously, he would have created a light show. Why did no one witness this firework display? What happened to the matchsticks?

[DJA]

Last night you could not walk around my house block without a flashlight.
There is a HP sodium lamp 300 metres away.

Tonight the weather has cleared,after an icy blast.
Full moon.
Able to walk around unaided.
Beautiful night!

[Abby Normal]

It was pitch black in Dutfield's Yard. We know this because Lave couldn't even see the door to let himself back into the club.

It's therefore likely that the passage was even darker, i.e because it was narrower and enclosed on three sides. Then there's the testimony of PC Long in which he states he couldn't even see the wall, let alone the writing, without his bullseye lamp.

You cannot just ignore all this contemporary evidence. And trying to make comparisons with light-polluted 2017 isn't helpful.

And don't forget, it not only has to be legible to write but write leigibly.

Lighting matches would have been a crazy idea. For a start, as I noted in my earlier post, have had to light around 10 matches. And considering white phosphorus matches were chemically similar to napalm, and burned ferociously, he would have created a light show. Why did no one witness this firework display? What happened to the matchsticks?

good point re lave. also diemshitz had to light a match to get a better look at stride.
also good point re modern light pollution.
Point taken.

[Bridewell]

So He was never out during the day? Had no days off? I suggest the idea of the killer writing this is a great stretch. If he really cared about a message, he would have put it there when conditions were good for writing quickly and neatly, even if done in stages.

Mike

Quite. If the killer wrote the message then he took a piece of chalk out with him to do that. It would have been just as easy to have taken a piece of paper and a pencil. In fact he could have saved a great deal of time (and risk) by writing the message in advance on a piece of paper and stuffing it in the victim's clothing where it was sure to be found. That would have removed any ambiguity as to the authorship. The GSG was not the only graffito in London and I think it quite likely that there would have been graffiti nearby wherever the apron piece was dumped. It could have been written by the killer but, on the balance of probabilities, I would say not.

[Harry D]

Quite. If the killer wrote the message then he took a piece of chalk out with him to do that. It would have been just as easy to have taken a piece of paper and a pencil. In fact he could have saved a great deal of time (and risk) by writing the message in advance on a piece of paper and stuffing it in the victim's clothing where it was sure to be found. That would have removed any ambiguity as to the authorship. The GSG was not the only graffito in London and I think it quite likely that there would have been graffiti nearby wherever the apron piece was dumped. It could have been written by the killer but, on the balance of probabilities, I would say not.

But to play devil's advocate, why assume the GSG was premeditated? Some theorize that it was written in response to Schwartz and the other Jews thwarting him that night.

[Abby Normal]

But to play devil's advocate, why assume the GSG was premeditated? Some theorize that it was written in response to Schwartz and the other Jews thwarting him that night.

exactly. and what keeps coming back to me re the lighting/visability issue is this-if it was impossible to see, and therefore impossible to write (which I don't agree with) then why did so many police at the time think it was written by the killer? surely they were there at the time and know more about the conditions than we do. if this precluded it being written by the killer, than why is there no mention of it by any police (or anyone for that matter) at the time, who, quite the contrary, thought the killer had written it?

[Sam Flynn]

But to play devil's advocate, why assume the GSG was premeditated? Some theorize that it was written in response to Schwartz and the other Jews thwarting him that night.

It's not just the GSG, though. It's the decision to cut a piece of apron in Mitre Square, the decision to take it to Goulston Street, deciding on a message to write, and writing the message in the same doorway. None of this sounds like a spontaneous response to having been thwarted - Schwarted? - in Berner Street.

[Harry D]

It's not just the GSG, though. It's the decision to cut a piece of apron in Mitre Square, the decision to take it to Goulston Street, deciding on a message to write, and writing the message in the same doorway. None of this sounds like a spontaneous response to having been thwarted - Schwarted? - in Berner Street.

I fail to see why, Sam. Let's assume the killer took the apron piece for practical purposes (e.g. carry the organs, clean up, or bandage a cut). We can only speculate on the killer's movements after the murder, he may have ducked into a bolthole to drop off his 'trophies'. However, still fuming from being interrupted with Long Liz by those dastardly Juden, he writes the graffito inside the doorway and drops the apron piece to authenticate it.

"Schwarted" - I'm stealing that!

[Sam Flynn]

"Schwarted" - I'm stealing that!

Be my guest, Harry

[Abby Normal]

I fail to see why, Sam. Let's assume the killer took the apron piece for practical purposes (e.g. carry the organs, clean up, or bandage a cut). We can only speculate on the killer's movements after the murder, he may have ducked into a bolthole to drop off his 'trophies'. However, still fuming from being interrupted with Long Liz by those dastardly Juden, he writes the graffito inside the doorway and drops the apron piece to authenticate it.

"Schwarted" - I'm stealing that!

exactly! or any number of scenarios similar.

perhaps not knowing he was going to be bothered by a bunch of jews that night he dosnt have any chalk with him, so when gets back to his bolt hole with his goodies and apron piece, he decides what hes going to do to get back at them, , and grabs a piece of chalk with the apron and heads back out to goulston street.