Height of GSG a Clue?

[perrymason]

Hello all,

A note to Stewart first off, do you know if the precise location of the writing is one that would be affected by the rain? It was raining earlier, but I believe it had ended near the time we first see Elizabeth on Berner Street. I dont know if it would be a factor for that dado. I recall that there was some discussion that the writing might be brushed in passing by someone, and that site does get very busy. Could it have been blurred as a result of some accidental brushing?

On the height of the writing, I think its fair to assume that if the man who left the apron piece wrote it, he would do so discreetly...and crouching seems in keeping with the height to me. In other words an adult male, not a child.

If the killer didnt write it, he just endorsed it. IMHO.

Best regards all.

[The Good Michael]

If the killer didnt write it, he just endorsed it. IMHO.

Thanks for taking my side on this one. I don't see JTR writing it, just liking it.
Yet, I know your're giving just an "if there's a connection" scenario. I agree that the height doesn't seem to matter at all, but a dado is an inset in the wall, if I'm not mistaken, so the fact that it's inset may be more important, psychologically than the height.

Mike

[Wickerman]

.....I agree that the height doesn't seem to matter at all, but a dado is an inset in the wall, if I'm not mistaken, so the fact that it's inset may be more important, psychologically than the height.

If I'm not mistaken a dado is a moulded or carved design that looks like it is not part of the general surroundings. Today they can be made of plaster of styrofoam.
Here is some dado work still evident above the tenements in Goulston st. painted white.

[Wickerman]

Perhaps some detailed dado work originally extended farther down the doorway on both sides. We can see the brickwork appears well chipped for some reason from just over halfway up the door jamb.

[Wickerman]

So with all the above in mind, lets look at these old pictures from Goulston St. (courtesy of who?).
Does anybody think that some dado designs appear to embrace both sides of those doorways farther down than in the more recent close-up view?

[Scott Nelson]

Which side(s) of the street are these images showing? I would think that any dado designs on one side of a street would not be copied on the other side. You know, like two women wearing the same dress to a party...

[Sam Flynn]

Which side(s) of the street are these images showing?

The more sharply-defined image (the upper one, with the writing on it) shows Wentworth Model Dwellings, Scott. Taken from Wentworth Street, facing south/south-east.

[Wickerman]

The more sharply-defined image (the upper one, with the writing on it) shows Wentworth Model Dwellings, Scott. Taken from Wentworth Street, facing south/south-east.

Actually, I thought both photo's show the same buildings, one looking down the street, the next looking up the street. The architecture of both buildings tends to suggest this.

[Sam Flynn]

Actually, I thought both photo's show the same buildings, one looking down the street, the next looking up the street. The architecture of both buildings tends to suggest this.

I agree, Jon - but for Scott's (and others') benefit, I thought I'd better point to the clearer photo.

[The Good Michael]

Here's the best online definition of 'dado' I could find:

Dado
Noun 1. dado - panel forming the lower part of an interior wall when it is finished differently from the rest
wainscot
panel - sheet that forms a distinct (usually flat) section or component of something
wall - an architectural partition with a height and length greater than its thickness; used to divide or enclose an area or to support another structure; "the south wall had a small window"; "the walls were covered with pictures"

2. dado - the section of a pedestal between the base and the surbase
footstall, plinth, pedestal - an architectural support or base (as for a column or statue)
segment, section - one of several parts or pieces that fit with others to constitute a whole object; "a section of a fishing rod"; "metal sections were used below ground"; "finished the final segment of the road"

3. dado - a rectangular groove cut into a board so that another piece can fit into it
groove, channel - a long narrow furrow cut either by a natural process (such as erosion) or by a tool (as e.g. a groove in a phonograph record)

Using these definitions, 'dado' must mean, in this instance, a sheet that forms a distinct (usually flat) section or component of something. That would make sense because a flat piece of say... wood, would be easier to write on than brick. Yet, a furrow cut by natural process (erosion of brick) would make sense too. A projection of moulding doesn't work here. Perhaps, the word 'dado' was used incorrectly and was meant to just mean the base of the wall?

Cheers,

Mike

[Stewart P Evans]

Writing

A note to Stewart first off, do you know if the precise location of the writing is one that would be affected by the rain? It was raining earlier, but I believe it had ended near the time we first see Elizabeth on Berner Street. I dont know if it would be a factor for that dado. I recall that there was some discussion that the writing might be brushed in passing by someone, and that site does get very busy. Could it have been blurred as a result of some accidental brushing?

All I know about the actual location of the writing is what appears in the various reports of the time. Like Jon, I have always imagined that it was located on the entrance surround as shown in his post # 126. Thus, being at right angles to the street and not on the outside part it would be sheltered from the rain unless a strong wind was blowing the rain into the entranceway.

[Monty]

Guys,

The dwellings were built only a few years (or so) before the murders. At the same time, the buildings opposite the dwellings (between New Goulston St and Wentworth St) were also built to the same design.

Therefore the entrances in that area were all the same.

I had the good fortune to visit the dwellings with Rob Clack and Phil Hutchinson a couple of years ago. We noted that the second entrance toward the south bore a striking similarity to the one in the Whittingham-Egan photo.

The bricks were porous, very porous, yet smooth in places. And they were actually black. There was a debate on if they were painted or not. Now I swear Rob did take some photos of this but in all the excitement Im not certain.

However, I am certain that he took photos of the rear of the dwellings. We managed to gain access via a passageway one Sunday morning, as the markets were setting up, and I know for certain he took pictures then. Now that was interesting.

Cheers
Monty

[Rob Clack]

I think I am right in saying that all these coloured buildings were classed as Wentworth Dwellings, and as Neil said they were all built at the same time.



This is a sample of the brickwork from one of the other doorways



And this is what some vandal did on the back of the buildings. Might still be there.



Rob

[perrymason]

Thanks for that post Rob, and for your reply to my question Stewart.

I think based on the middle photo that Rob posted, which if exactly like the other entrances, in my opinion, it shows why the writing would start at around 48 inches, because its about at that height the black brick ends. Black being the superior contrast background to write in white on,....rather than on the yellow or red brick above.

Good Mike, your second dado definition hinted at "support", or a "structural" element, I think that is what the key is here, it was not moulding which in all cases is decorative only. Also, the lower black brick is certainly applied to a "structural" or "support" section of the wall,...the load bearing part, the bottom.

Best regards all.

[Monty]

Rob,

And this is what some vandal did on the back of the buildings. Might still be there.

Dont mention the apron.

Thanks for the photos and Goads. I kinda remember you taking the entrance photo.

Monty


PS See, I can post about your photos without mentioning lens caps.