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Letter dated 14th October 1896.

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  • #16
    Originally posted by c.d. View Post
    Hello Joshua,

    I would say it was most likely to have been the 1888 letter. I think the giveaway is the word "enterprising" as this seems to indicate someone who capitalized on the original hysteria surrounding the murders.

    c.d.
    Yup. I’ve always wondered if they knew for sure that if it was bulling or his boss at the CNA why they continued to be persona gratis around the station.

    You would think at the very least they would have been pissed at them for all the trouble the letters caused.

    And the fact that he was worried about libel only shows he didn’t know it for sure. Or at all.

    I’ll say it again, that the dear boss, saucy jack letters are a known hoax is the biggest myth in ripperology.
    "Is all that we see or seem
    but a dream within a dream?"

    -Edgar Allan Poe


    "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
    quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

    -Frederick G. Abberline

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by c.d. View Post
      Hello Joshua,

      I would say it was most likely to have been the 1888 letter. I think the giveaway is the word "enterprising" as this seems to indicate someone who capitalized on the original hysteria surrounding the murders.
      Good point. c.d.
      And of course the 1896 letter was sent direct to the police at Leman St rather than to a press agency, so didn't get the same newspaper exposure, if any, that the original Dear Boss letter received.

      I'm intrigued by the mention of "Winter's coming" though....is a Game of Thrones reference a pointer to the Royal Conspiracy theory?

      Comment


      • #18
        great discussion.

        IMHO I put dearboss/saucy jack letters as about 60% (to put a number on it) probability coming from the ripper. with winters coming letter at slighty better than 50/50. I lean towards it just ever slightly as coming from same author.

        what tips the scale for me is the inclusion of the GSG. this is eight years later-seems odd a hoaxer would remember it and still even spell the word jews wrong.
        "Is all that we see or seem
        but a dream within a dream?"

        -Edgar Allan Poe


        "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
        quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

        -Frederick G. Abberline

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
          what tips the scale for me is the inclusion of the GSG. this is eight years later-seems odd a hoaxer would remember it and still even spell the word jews wrong.
          Albeit the hoaxer uses the wrong wrong spelling... jewes as opposed to juwes, juws or juews.
          Kind regards, Sam Flynn

          "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

          Comment


          • #20
            Afternoon all, just passing this along from KS.

            TO JOSHUA

            Thanks Joshua. I see what you mean about the hyphens in the colour photograph but you would probably need to examine the original document in the National Archives to satisfy yourself they were definite hyphens before developing a theory that Anderson may have been referring to the October 14th 1896 letter. Also check out whether any of the other surviving letters, purporting to have been sent by Jack the Ripper, are similarly hyphenated because the argument could then be made that perhaps Anderson had that one in mind rather than the October 14th 1896 letter? To the best of my knowledge though the October 14th 1896 letter was never on display in the Police Museum. Swanson’s directive to Moore was that the letter should be put with with other similar letters which I take to be the existing letters in the National Archives, some of which Swanson, it appears, was inclined to take seriously.

            Best, KS.

            Now you're looking for the secret, but you won't find it, because of course, you're not really looking. You want to be fooled.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
              Albeit the hoaxer uses the wrong wrong spelling... jewes as opposed to juwes, juws or juews.
              true but still wrong. the main point is bringing up the GSG message at all. I mean after 8 years, someone is going to remember that?

              remember the GSG was wiped of and got relatively little press.
              "Is all that we see or seem
              but a dream within a dream?"

              -Edgar Allan Poe


              "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
              quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

              -Frederick G. Abberline

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
                true but still wrong. the main point is bringing up the GSG message at all. I mean after 8 years, someone is going to remember that?

                remember the GSG was wiped of and got relatively little press.
                The juwes/juws/juews misspellings were reported in the press, however. In contrast, apart from this letter, doesn't the spelling "jewes" only appear in internal police memos?
                Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

                Comment


                • #23
                  This report appeared in the Gloucester Journal 13th October 1888.

                  On Wednesday morning the following letter, bearing the London postmark and dated October 9th was received by the editor of The Western Mail Cardiff:-

                  " Dear Old Boss- What do you think of my little games here- ha!ha! Next Saturday I am going to give the St Mary street girls a turn. I shall be fairly on their track, you bet. Keep this back until I have done some work. Ha! ha! Shall down Friday- Yours, JACK THE RIPPER (trade mark)"
                  The St Mary street referred to is in Cardiff. No importance is attached to this communication.

                  This letter is hyphenated in the report, although obviously it would be better to see the original.

                  All the best.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    On November 22nd 1888 The Citizen reported the following:

                    Singular Incident at Cardiff

                    Mr Edward Rowland, deaf and dumb missionary, residing at Pontypridd, writes: When I was passing Wyndham- crescent, Canton on Tuesday night, at seven o' clock, a young man with dark clothes and black moustache, came and walked a little way with me. I touched my ear to say that I was deaf, and he put his hands in his pockets for paper and pencil, and at a shop window he wrote with chalk on the sill this:- "Can you tell me the names of fallen women?" I was terrified and left him

                    All the best.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                      The juwes/juws/juews misspellings were reported in the press, however. In contrast, apart from this letter, doesn't the spelling "jewes" only appear in internal police memos?
                      That’s a great question. I don’t know.

                      But the fact that the writer didn’t spell it with the u shows to me that he wasn’t writing the letter with press reports as I think a hoaxer would more than likely do.
                      "Is all that we see or seem
                      but a dream within a dream?"

                      -Edgar Allan Poe


                      "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                      quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                      -Frederick G. Abberline

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        14 October, 1896

                        Dear Boss,

                        You will be surprised to find
                        that this comes from yours
                        as of old Jack-the Ripper. Ha Ha
                        If my old friend Mr. Warren is dead
                        you can read it. you might
                        remember me if you try and
                        think a little Ha Ha. The last job
                        was a bad one and no mistake nearly
                        buckled, and meant it to
                        be best of the lot & what curse it,
                        Ha Ha Im alive yet and you'll
                        soon find it out. I meant to go
                        on again and when I get the chance
                        wont it be nice dear old Boss to
                        have the good old times once
                        again. you never caught me
                        and you never will. Ha Ha
                        You police are a smart lot, the lot
                        of you could nt catch one man
                        Where have I been Dear Boss
                        you d like to know. abroad, if
                        you would like to know, and
                        just come back, ready to go on
                        with my work and stop when
                        you catch me. Well good bye
                        Boss wish me luck. Winters coming
                        “The Jewes are people that are
                        blamed for nothing” Ha Ha
                        have you heard this before

                        Yours truly
                        Jack the Ripper

                        Andrew's the man, that is not blamed for nothing

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by NotBlamedForNothing View Post
                          14 October, 1896

                          Dear Boss,

                          You will be surprised to find
                          that this comes from yours
                          as of old Jack-the Ripper. Ha Ha
                          If my old friend Mr. Warren is dead
                          you can read it. you might
                          remember me if you try and
                          think a little Ha Ha. The last job
                          was a bad one and no mistake nearly
                          buckled, and meant it to
                          be best of the lot & what curse it,
                          Ha Ha Im alive yet and you'll
                          soon find it out. I meant to go
                          on again and when I get the chance
                          wont it be nice dear old Boss to
                          have the good old times once
                          again. you never caught me
                          and you never will. Ha Ha
                          You police are a smart lot, the lot
                          of you could nt catch one man
                          Where have I been Dear Boss
                          you d like to know. abroad, if
                          you would like to know, and
                          just come back, ready to go on
                          with my work and stop when
                          you catch me. Well good bye
                          Boss wish me luck. Winters coming
                          “The Jewes are people that are
                          blamed for nothing” Ha Ha
                          have you heard this before

                          Yours truly
                          Jack the Ripper
                          thanks for posting. any thoughts?
                          "Is all that we see or seem
                          but a dream within a dream?"

                          -Edgar Allan Poe


                          "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                          quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                          -Frederick G. Abberline

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post

                            thanks for posting. any thoughts?
                            Yes. It is all clear to me now.
                            I cannot sleep, but I feel good.
                            Andrew's the man, that is not blamed for nothing

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              The last job was a bad one and no mistake nearly buckled, and meant it to be best of the lot & what curse it

                              Given that Kelly was the 'best of the lot', does this section refer to a later murder, or attempted murder?

                              On the other hand, how could he do a 'better job' than MJK?
                              In that case, what does 'nearly buckled' suggest?
                              Was Jack still in the room when Thomas Bowyer knocked?
                              Caroline Maxwell last saw Kelly around a few minutes before 9:00.
                              The police recorded Bowyer's discovery as being at 10:30.
                              Is it possible he got very lucky - managing to escape just before Bowyer returned with McCarthy?

                              Walter Dew: If Mrs Maxwell had been a sensation seeker - one of those women who live for the limelight - it would have been easy to discredit her story. She was not. She seemed a sane and sensible woman, and her reputation was excellent. In one way at least her version fitted into the facts as known. We knew that Marie had been drinking the previous night, and, as this was not a habit of hers, illness the next morning was just what might have been expected.
                              Andrew's the man, that is not blamed for nothing

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by NotBlamedForNothing View Post
                                The last job was a bad one and no mistake nearly buckled, and meant it to be best of the lot & what curse it

                                Given that Kelly was the 'best of the lot', does this section refer to a later murder, or attempted murder?

                                On the other hand, how could he do a 'better job' than MJK?
                                In that case, what does 'nearly buckled' suggest?
                                Was Jack still in the room when Thomas Bowyer knocked?
                                Caroline Maxwell last saw Kelly around a few minutes before 9:00.
                                The police recorded Bowyer's discovery as being at 10:30.
                                Is it possible he got very lucky - managing to escape just before Bowyer returned with McCarthy?
                                hi not
                                if this letter is authentic, and i think there is a chance it is and written by same man as dear boss and saucy jack, then last one refers to mckenzie and posssibly pc andrews as the buckler, since he discovered the body and possibly scared the ripper off.
                                "Is all that we see or seem
                                but a dream within a dream?"

                                -Edgar Allan Poe


                                "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                                quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                                -Frederick G. Abberline

                                Comment

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