Best sighting of the Ripper AFTER a murder?

[lynn cates]

bingo

Hello Harry.

"Would it be the bloodstained man who drank in the Prince Albert after the Chapman's murder, assumed by some to be Jacob Isenschmid?"

Bingo.

Cheers.
LC

[Joshua Rogan]

'The only trace considered of any value is the story of a watch boy who saw a man and woman leave Aldgate Station, going towards Mitre Square. The man returned shortly afterwards alone. The police have a good description of him.'

Presumably, it's the timing of this incident that makes it seem 'fishy' (although no actual time seems to be given). It can't have been an uncommon sight for a man to walk a lady to her door - Morris Eagle did just that before returning to the Berner Street club.

[S.Brett]

The night watchman at Aldgate seeing a couple and then a male is mentioned on the 'Watkins walking on his beat towards Eddowes' thread here, but I'm going to have to track it more specifically. It was on a thread which examined what route Eddowes could have taken between the police station and Mitre Square. Sometimes these threads take some remarkable twists and diversions from the original thread title!

Hi Rosella!

I seem to remember that the "Eddowes´route" was examined (by Jeff Leahy?) in one of the following threads but I am not quite sure:

http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?p=359125

http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread.php?t=24375&page=18

Karsten.

[Michael W Richards]

For me its either the sighting of Isenschmid in the pub, or Galloways sighting of a blotchy faced man while crossing Whitechapel Rd. on Wednesday, the 14th of November.

[SuspectZero]

In your opinion, what is the closest we have to a sighting of the killer AFTER one of the murders? We have plenty of alleged sightings of the killer before the grisly murders took place but there was barely a glimpse of the killer after he took his next victim and slipped into the shadows. I've always found this quite extraordinary. Whether the killer was a cool customer or raving psychopath, you'd have thought that somebody would've seen something in the crowded suburb of Whitechapel.

Would it be the bloodstained man who drank in the Prince Albert after the Chapman's murder, assumed by some to be Jacob Isenschmid?

Is it the guy said to be in Church Lane wiping his hands on the steps after the Eddowes murder?

Or how about Sergeants White's (probably apocryphal) tale of the spooky individual he came face-to-face with moments before they found one of the victims?

I'm inclined to believe the PC report about the doctor with the bloodstained cuffs he arrested after one of the murders who was supposedly in the neighborhood doing "social work".
That doctor died a few months later and his wife went to work at a hospital for the criminally insane.

[Rosella]

Thank you Karsten for your links. I did finally track down the elusive thread I needed after all! See above!

[Rosella]

Wasn't the Galloway sighting explained (after he was giving the brush off) by this particular Ginger blotchy face assisting the police? I seem to remember speculation that he may have been a Vigilance Committee member, though I have to say his behaviour in the Whitechapel Road incident was bizarre to say the least!

[Harry D]

I'm inclined to believe the PC report about the doctor with the bloodstained cuffs he arrested after one of the murders who was supposedly in the neighborhood doing "social work".
That doctor died a few months later and his wife went to work at a hospital for the criminally insane.

PC 101h Robert Spicer(Subsequently discharged for being drunk on duty) encounters "Rosy", a prostitute, sitting on a dustbin off Heneage st with a Brixton Dr who had blood on his cuffs, Spicer claims to have arrested him, but to have been reprimanded for his pains.

^ I take this is what you're referring to, SuspectZero?

Does sound like an interesting lead. I'm surprised I haven't see more discussion about this incident. Heneage St is only about 15 minutes walking distance from Mitre Square isn't it?

[Wickerman]

PC 101h Robert Spicer(Subsequently discharged for being drunk on duty) encounters "Rosy", a prostitute, sitting on a dustbin off Heneage st with a Brixton Dr who had blood on his cuffs, Spicer claims to have arrested him, but to have been reprimanded for his pains.

^ I take this is what you're referring to, SuspectZero?

Does sound like an interesting lead. I'm surprised I haven't see more discussion about this incident. Heneage St is only about 15 minutes walking distance from Mitre Square isn't it?

Yes I took it that the subject was PC Spicer's newspaper story from the 1930's.
Though my understanding was that this doctor was never identified so I don't see how it could be determined that this Brixton doctor died a few months later.

Spicer's story is never given much credibility, yet if we accept the story as given, it would contest many accepted theories about the killer's movements on the night of the double-event.
Rather than believe the killer was heading east away from Mitre square going home, if we take Spicer at his word, we might have to consider the killer was actually looking for a third victim that night.

[Scott Nelson]

Spicer's suspect may have been Dr. James Gloster according to Martin Roberts.

[SuspectZero]

PC 101h Robert Spicer(Subsequently discharged for being drunk on duty) encounters "Rosy", a prostitute, sitting on a dustbin off Heneage st with a Brixton Dr who had blood on his cuffs, Spicer claims to have arrested him, but to have been reprimanded for his pains.

^ I take this is what you're referring to, SuspectZero?

Does sound like an interesting lead. I'm surprised I haven't see more discussion about this incident. Heneage St is only about 15 minutes walking distance from Mitre Square isn't it?

Hi Harry,
That's the one. It is interesting. Jon-I tracked the doctor down and he's real. He died a short while after Kelly, from a terminal illness. Died bankrupt after after having a large medical practice. I tracked his wife as well. She ended up working with the criminally insane. Scott- I don't believe it was Gloster but I'll have to go back and find my research notes.

[Wickerman]

.... Jon-I tracked the doctor down and he's real. He died a short while after Kelly, from a terminal illness. Died bankrupt after after having a large medical practice. I tracked his wife as well. She ended up working with the criminally insane. Scott- I don't believe it was Gloster but I'll have to go back and find my research notes.

Thankyou for the update, have you compiled this research anywhere for us to read through?

[SuspectZero]

Thankyou for the update, have you compiled this research anywhere for us to read through?

No, Jon. I only joined in November, so I've only posted the Abberline Masonic data and the Ann Druitt medical history so far. Since this particular subject just came up, I have not provided any data yet. I am in Paris but arriving back in the US later today. I will try and provide you this information tomorrow (Sunday).
Regards,
M

[Harry D]

Hi Harry,
That's the one. It is interesting. Jon-I tracked the doctor down and he's real. He died a short while after Kelly, from a terminal illness. Died bankrupt after after having a large medical practice. I tracked his wife as well. She ended up working with the criminally insane. Scott- I don't believe it was Gloster but I'll have to go back and find my research notes.

Apparently PC Spicer told the Daily Express that he was reprimanded for arresting said doctor and subsequently taken off the investigation. He went on to add that no one questioned the doctor about the killings or bothered to inspect the parcel he was carrying. Bear in mind that this was many years after the fact, and Spicer wouldn't have been the first ex-copper to tell a tall-tale about the day he almost caught the Ripper. It's also worth noting that Spicer might have been harbouring a grudge towards the MET for kicking him off the force for drunkenness.

[SuspectZero]

Apparently PC Spicer told the Daily Express that he was reprimanded for arresting said doctor and subsequently taken off the investigation. He went on to add that no one questioned the doctor about the killings or bothered to inspect the parcel he was carrying. Bear in mind that this was many years after the fact, and Spicer wouldn't have been the first ex-copper to tell a tall-tale about the day he almost caught the Ripper. It's also worth noting that Spicer might have been harbouring a grudge towards the MET for kicking him off the force for drunkenness.

Yes, that's the gossip. But there really was this Brixton doctor and there was a connection to Spicer. Supposedly he was doing some kind of social charity work which is why he was in the East End. Odd type of social services work for someone dressed so well at 1:30 ish in the morning.