Chicksand St, opposite The Frying Pan pub...

[Cubitt]

Hello, I'm a long time forum lurker here, but first time poster. But I've decided to take the plunge and join!

Specifically, I have a question regarding the area around Bricklane and Wentworth Street. Having started on that modern fad of genealogy, I've discovered that we had ancestors who owned a grocers shop at number 3 Chicksand Street (blue on the map, below) from the 1850's to the 1880's (although they were still there in 1881 I don't know if they were still there by 1888).

Is it possible to tell which end of the street number 3 would have been? I'm wondering if they would have been at the end of the street opposite the Frying Pan pub on the corner of Thrawl St where Mary Nichols had her last drink. Does anyone know anything about the pub back then?

The son of the grocers also lived locally, in Petticoat Square at the end of Wentworth Street (red on the map, below). His daughter was born on the day of the Stride inquest. I've not been able to uncover anything whatsoever about Petticoat Sq.

Does anyone know any more about Petticoat Sq, Chicksand St or the Frying Pan Pub?

Any info I can glean from you experienced crew will be much appreciated and I promise I'm not using you just for my research! I've been interested in this case for many years (discovering a family connection recently has been a real blast!) so I'll be back posting again soon

Many, many thanks for reading this far!

[John Bennett]

Hello Cubitt, welcome aboard.

No.3 Chicksand Street was on the north side of the street, just above the word 'school' on the map you posted.

Hope this is of use.

JB

[Rob Clack]

Hi Cubitt,

Number 3 Chicksand Street was on the North side between Brick Lane and Spelman Street
This map is from 1938 but the numbering was the same:



Petticoat Square was swallowed up by these Artizan Dwellings. Don't know when they were built but this map is from 1887.



Rob

[George Hutchinson]

I will have to look through my own archives but earlier this year I bought a Building News sheet on the construction of the Artizans Dwellings showing the elevations and what have you. Being dated, this will show (if I can find it!) when Petticoat Square came down.

PHILIP

[Cubitt]

Brilliant stuff, many thanks. You lot really know your stuff.

As a printers compositor I guess it makes sense for my g.g.grandfather to have lived in the Artisan dwellings in Petticoat Sq. Mr Hutchinson, any extra info you may have on the dwellings would be greatly appreciated I'd love to try and track down where his place of work was and which publications came from there.

Also, great to see where 3 Chicksand Street is. I have shambled up and down it vaguely wondering where the grocers would have been but little of the old street remains and it's impossible to tell.

I have visited the modern site of Petticoat Sq too and sadly neither the square or the street have retained any of their historical buildings, both being prime examples of the concrete monstrosities of the sixties and seventies. Frustratingly, I recently discovered that no. 8 Chicksand St was standing as recently as the 1950's but it seems has since been demolished. Whether through enemy action or purposeful slum clearance, I don't know.

[George Hutchinson]

I found the items this afternoon, and they're from THE BUILDER of October 20th, 1883.







PHILIP

[Rob Clack]

Hi Philip,

Very nice, unfortunately it's the wrong one. Yours is in Oxford Street behind the London Hospital.

Rob

[George Hutchinson]

Ah - didn't check that. I thought there was only one 'Artizan's Dwellings' - so it's referring to function rather than title, I take it.

PHILIP

[Monty]

Steady on Rob, you just cant go around pointing out Philips honest errors. After all, AP is relying on you compling of his image of you as loyal man servant. Youve just balls that up.

[George Hutchinson]

It's OK, Monty. The above illustrations were created in Photoshop anyway.

PHILIP

[Rob Clack]

And you still can't get the cobbles right

[Sam Flynn]

It's OK, Monty. The above illustrations were created in Photoshop anyway.

...but there are no by-standers to be seen, which - as we know - must mean that the images are genuine.

[George Hutchinson]

And you still can't get the cobbles right

Ah, if only I had the gift of the cobblers like yourself, Rob.

PHILIP

[Rob Clack]

Hope your not putting the boot in Philip

[Cubitt]

Thanks for the images anyway Phil. They may not be exactly the right dwellings but they'll give me an idea of what the Petticoat Square ones may have looked like.

I've already told Rob Clack about this, but I've been sniffing about the 1890 Goad maps for the area in the British Library over the festive period. I found the relevant sheets and somehow managed to spend hours just pouring over them and getting to know the Bricklane, Wentworth Street, Petticoat Square areas as they were then.

By the way Rob - I was wrong to say the Chicksand Street numbering had changed between the 1890 and 1899. In my rush to look at the 1899 sheets (just as they were kicking me out of the map room) I looked at the wrong page. On a return visit I discovered I'd been looking at a sheet that was further down Chicksand street. Whoops!