Casebook: Jack the Ripper - Main
   

Introduction
Victims
Suspects
Witnesses
Ripper Letters
Police Officials
Official Documents
Press Reports
Victorian London
Message Boards
Ripper Media
Authors
Dissertations
Timelines
Games & Diversions
Photo Archive
Ripper Wiki
Casebook Examiner
Ripper Podcast
About the Casebook

Most Recent Posts:
Hutchinson, George: Any updates, or opinions on this witness. - by rjpalmer 3 minutes ago.
Non-Fiction: the victims werent prostitutes - by rjpalmer 13 minutes ago.
Hutchinson, George: Any updates, or opinions on this witness. - by Simon Wood 22 minutes ago.
Hutchinson, George: Any updates, or opinions on this witness. - by rjpalmer 55 minutes ago.
Non-Fiction: the victims werent prostitutes - by Varqm 3 hours ago.
Elizabeth Stride: For what reason do we include Stride? - by DirectorDave 4 hours ago.

Most Popular Threads:
Elizabeth Stride: For what reason do we include Stride? - (35 posts)
Motive, Method and Madness: JtR was Law Enforcement Hypothesis - (14 posts)
Hutchinson, George: Any updates, or opinions on this witness. - (11 posts)
Non-Fiction: the victims werent prostitutes - (3 posts)
A6 Murders: A6 Rebooted - (3 posts)
Non-Fiction: The Whitechapel Murders of 1888: Another Dead End? - (2 posts)

Wiki Updates:
Robert Sagar
Edit: Chris
May 9, 2015, 12:32 am
Online newspaper archives
Edit: Chris
Nov 26, 2014, 10:25 am
Joseph Lawende
Edit: Chris
Mar 9, 2014, 10:12 am
Miscellaneous research resources
Edit: Chris
Feb 13, 2014, 9:28 am
Charles Cross
Edit: John Bennett
Sep 4, 2013, 8:20 pm

Most Recent Blogs:
Mike Covell: A DECADE IN THE MAKING.
February 19, 2016, 11:12 am.
Chris George: RipperCon in Baltimore, April 8-10, 2016
February 10, 2016, 2:55 pm.
Mike Covell: Hull Prison Visit
October 10, 2015, 8:04 am.
Mike Covell: NEW ADVENTURES IN RESEARCH
August 9, 2015, 3:10 am.
Mike Covell: UPDDATES FOR THE PAST 11 MONTHS
November 14, 2014, 10:02 am.
Mike Covell: Mike’s Book Releases
March 17, 2014, 3:18 am.

Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Media > Audio -- Visual

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-07-2008, 10:13 AM
j.r-ahde j.r-ahde is offline
Inspector
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: finland, the center of the universe!
Posts: 1,146
Default "Is it for real?"

Hello you all!

Yesterday one of the Finnish tv-channels showed a documentary of JtR of the "Is it for real?" -series.

I found it pretty objective and focusing on three main Ripper researchers; Stephen P. Ryder, mr. Newton and mrs. Cornwell.

Then there were some criminal experts and a freemason gving their commentary. The newest thing to me was, that mr. Newton thought the locations of the murders forming a pattern of pisces. Thus relating the murders to a suspect called D'Onston.

Since the one I had heard was, that they would form a five-end star. Thus relating to the free-masons. However, a free-mason representative told the Ripper to have failed miserably, if he wanted to take the blame on the freemasons.

The professional police investigator in the documentary told, that in every murder case one can make any patterns with the murder-locations.

Then mrs. Cornwell. The graphologists could connect a few prank letters to mr. Sickert. But so what?! Since no-one knows for sure, if any letters were written by the actual killer. And, like mrs. Cornwall claims, if Sickert would have continued after MJK, probably the "works" would have become even more horrendous.

All right, after adding some personal points, the most sense-making Ripper researcher was; Stephen P. Ryder. Yes, since his point was; he was probably an every-day man, maybe even with a family, in the East End. That one is really close to mine; I think, the Ripper was someone The Scotland Yard never thought of at the time and neither have we!

Then, to the visual things; one of the documentary's impressive things was, that the actresses of the victims told themeselves to the camera about the things done to them. As if being the spirits of Nicholls, Chapman, Stride, Eddowes and Kelly.

All right, anyone else seen this? Your feelings about the documentary?

All the best
Jukka
__________________
"When I know all about everything, I am old. And it's a very, very long way to go!"
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-07-2008, 10:21 AM
Doctor X Doctor X is offline
Inactive
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 844
Default

While I do not get Finnish television----there was a documentary on the Free Masons with a small section on the Masons-Ripper theories. They debunked the "bodies form a pattern" myth amongst the other "Jack was a Mason" claims.

I think it was Philip Hutchinson who was interviewed.

As for your documentary, I think you--and Ryder--are correct. Jack was not a "famous" person we can find now.

Yours truly,

--J.D.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-07-2008, 10:40 AM
Mike Covell Mike Covell is offline
Superintendent
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: From Hell, From Hull
Posts: 2,957
Default

"Then there were some criminal experts and a freemason gving their commentary. The newest thing to me was, that mr. Newton thought the locations of the murders forming a pattern of pisces. Thus relating the murders to a suspect called D'Onston."

They got that wrong then becuase the murder scenes were supposed to be in the form of the Vesica Piscis, a form involving overlapping circles to form a shape in the centre.

The Pisces however is a star sign, its symbol is not unlike a H with slightly curved edges!!

Vesica Piscis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vesica_piscis
Pisces http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pisces_%28astrology%29
__________________
Regards Mike
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-07-2008, 01:07 PM
Howard Brown Howard Brown is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Greater Metropolitan Eagleville
Posts: 743
Default

Mike:

The Vesica Fishy is likewise a sign of passivity...

There's something like 8,000 links on Google and none that I've seen mention anything nefarious,devious,evil,scary,ominous or anything remotely close to some link to Beelzebub.

The silliest part of "Is It Real?" was the repetition of myths about D'onston in that he was a "doctor", "Satanist" and practitioner of black magic. Otherwise, there were some nice shots of The London Hospital and one cute girl who is shown walking by briefly.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-07-2008, 01:25 PM
Mike Covell Mike Covell is offline
Superintendent
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: From Hell, From Hull
Posts: 2,957
Default

Hi Howard, I was aware that the Vesica Piscis was a symbol of passivity and a symbol used by Christians to avoid persecution in the past.

If these are the "Facts" how could anyone turn it around to be a meaning of Black Magic, surely it would point to someone with a Religious Message, rather than the Black Magic "guff".
__________________
Regards Mike
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-07-2008, 04:14 PM
Dan Norder Dan Norder is offline
Sergeant
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 852
Default

See my "Connecting the Dots: Were the Ripper Crime Scenes Chosen to Form a Pattern?" from Ripper Notes #20 (and available online for free) for more information on that concept.
__________________

Dan Norder
Ripper Notes: The International Journal for Ripper Studies
Web site: www.RipperNotes.com - Email: dannorder@gmail.com
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-07-2008, 10:42 PM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
Casebook Supporter
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wales
Posts: 10,463
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Covell View Post
Hi Howard, I was aware that the Vesica Piscis was a symbol of passivity and a symbol used by Christians
The symbol, via the Greek word for fish, ICHTHUS, embodied the motto "Iesus CHristos THeou Uius Soter" ("Jesus Christ, Son of God, Saviour") as a neat acronym.
__________________
Kind regards, Sam Flynn

"Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-07-2008, 11:04 PM
Doctor X Doctor X is offline
Inactive
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 844
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
The symbol, via the Greek word for fish, ICHTHUS, embodied the motto "Iesus CHristos THeou Uius Soter" ("Jesus Christ, Son of God, Saviour") as a neat acronym.
So the Ripper was Soapy Sam?



--J.D.
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-07-2008, 11:41 PM
sdreid sdreid is offline
Commisioner
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: McWopetaz Metroplex, Illinois U. S. of A.
Posts: 4,957
Default

Hi Jukka,

By Mr. Newton, do you mean crime writer Michael Newton?

Was this a production done in Finland? If so, why didn't they consult you, Finland's resident Ripper expert?
__________________
This my opinion and to the best of my knowledge, that is, if I'm not joking.

Stan Reid
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-08-2008, 12:13 AM
j.r-ahde j.r-ahde is offline
Inspector
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: finland, the center of the universe!
Posts: 1,146
Default

Hello Stan!

No, it was an American programme. I may got the name wrong, since I didn't watch it right from the beginning!

All the best
Jukka
__________________
"When I know all about everything, I am old. And it's a very, very long way to go!"
Quick reply to this message Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:51 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.