The Johns Aren't Talking

[Barnaby]

I think it is a reasonable assumption that some of the canonical five provided their services to other johns the night they were murdered. Although autopsies did not reveal recent "connection," there are other ways of providing services and some actions (e.g., earning and drinking away doss money multiple times in a night) suggest that prostitution may have occurred.

If so, the johns did not come forward for obvious reasons. Was any attempt made to locate these men? If nothing else, it would help better establish a timeline.

[RockySullivan]

Good observation barnaby. Do you think the ripper was a "monger" or a frequent john of prostitutes...someone who spent most nights looking to pay for sex. Many mangers today spent all waking hours just cruising around looking for prostitutes...I imagine the case was the same on the east end at that time. So was the ripper a monger...who frequently hired women for sex on the east end? Was he a repeat customer? If the ripper was a john...which we don't know...it narrows down the suspect pool just a bit. Are there any indicating factors that point to the killer being a john? I think the fact that he seemed so comfortable could indicate he was dealing with something familiar....ie he frequented prostitutes.

Most prostitute killing serial killers are johns...in fact I don't know of any cases where they weren't. If the ripper was a repeat customer....that's a risk on his part because someone else might know...like another john or another prostitute. I think it's very likely the ripper frequently associated with prostitutes whether he was close with one (for instance pearly poll as Tom suggested) or was friends with a "pimp"...I think the ripper was associated with the girls somehow and not just a random john.

So yes I think finding johns who weren't just random johns but frequent flyers or regulars would be very important. Talk to the regulars especially anyone on Dorset or flower&dean. Interestingly enough...hutch is exactly what you described....a john...who appears to have been a regular of Mary Kelly's from her own account...came forward with a story...and hutch is very significant IMO. I'm sure the girls had many regulars like hutch ...yet he's the only who appears to have come forward....and not only did he come forward but he was such an upstanding regular...he waited outside MKs house while she was inside with "the ripper"....quite a virtuous john don't you think?

[SirJohnFalstaff]

Unless I'm wrong, I don't see in post mortem reports any mention or denial of recent sexual activities.

I was particularly interested in Martha Tabram/Turner. Wanting to know if she did have sex with the soldier, then got killed (by the soldier or someone else soon after)

[gnote]

Good observation barnaby. Do you think the ripper was a "monger" or a frequent john of prostitutes...someone who spent most nights looking to pay for sex. Many mangers today spent all waking hours just cruising around looking for prostitutes...I imagine the case was the same on the east end at that time. So was the ripper a monger...who frequently hired women for sex on the east end? Was he a repeat customer? If the ripper was a john...which we don't know...it narrows down the suspect pool just a bit. Are there any indicating factors that point to the killer being a john? I think the fact that he seemed so comfortable could indicate he was dealing with something familiar....ie he frequented prostitutes.

Most prostitute killing serial killers are johns...in fact I don't know of any cases where they weren't. If the ripper was a repeat customer....that's a risk on his part because someone else might know...like another john or another prostitute. I think it's very likely the ripper frequently associated with prostitutes whether he was close with one (for instance pearly poll as Tom suggested) or was friends with a "pimp"...I think the ripper was associated with the girls somehow and not just a random john.

So yes I think finding johns who weren't just random johns but frequent flyers or regulars would be very important. Talk to the regulars especially anyone on Dorset or flower&dean. Interestingly enough...hutch is exactly what you described....a john...who appears to have been a regular of Mary Kelly's from her own account...came forward with a story...and hutch is very significant IMO. I'm sure the girls had many regulars like hutch ...yet he's the only who appears to have come forward....and not only did he come forward but he was such an upstanding regular...he waited outside MKs house while she was inside with "the ripper"....quite a virtuous john don't you think?

I haven't read enough about the Hutchinson angle to form an opinion but i think it highly likely the Ripper was john. The frequency would be hard to gauge though.

He would have been comfortable speaking/negotiating with them as you pointed to. I find it highly unlikely the killer had little to no prior experience with prostitutes.

[Bridewell]

Unless I'm wrong, I don't see in post mortem reports any mention or denial of recent sexual activities.

I was particularly interested in Martha Tabram/Turner. Wanting to know if she did have sex with the soldier, then got killed (by the soldier or someone else soon after)

Tabram: Dr Keleene "stated positively that there were no signs of there having been recent connexion".

Eddowes: Dr Gordon "There were no traces of recent connexion".

[Cogidubnus]

Thanks Colin!

[SirJohnFalstaff]

Tabram: Dr Keleene "stated positively that there were no signs of there having been recent connexion".

Eddowes: Dr Gordon "There were no traces of recent connexion".

thanks. I must have missed that.

also, it's highly probable, unless there is something I don't know about victorian society, that prostitutes offered other services than intercourse.