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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Elizabeth Stride

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  #61  
Old 09-17-2018, 11:19 PM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Interesting observation, but "undone" and "torn" might betoken rather different things.
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  #62  
Old 09-18-2018, 01:33 AM
Trevor Marriott Trevor Marriott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
Interesting observation, but "undone" and "torn" might betoken rather different things.
My take on it to

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  #63  
Old 09-18-2018, 01:42 AM
Darryl Kenyon Darryl Kenyon is offline
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Morris Eagle said in his inquest testimony, Her feet were towards the gates, about six or seven feet from them. In other words, she was a good couple of metres within the yard. Now to my mind, Liz after being assaulted in the street would have gone kicking and screaming into Dutfileds with her assailant not just scream, not very loudly according to Schwartz. Yet nobody saw or heard her putting up a fight, nor is there any evidence that she did, in fact, the evidence points the other way, yes those damned cachous etc
This is what Schwartz said, The man tried to pull the woman into the street. Does that sound like a killer who then goes on to kill Liz in a darkened passageway, swiftly and silently? Not for me. Not only that but he draws attention to himself by shouting Lipski, and even if we surmise that he did this to scare Schwartz off how would he know that someone else, Fanny Mortimer, for instance, wouldn't come to her door to see what the commotion was and witnessed him? But of course, the cry of Lipski aimed at a man of strong Jewish appearance would almost certainly be thrown by a Gentile thus casting doubt on the IWEC being involved in the strong anti-Semitic climate.
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  #64  
Old 09-18-2018, 06:29 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Kenyon View Post
Morris Eagle said in his inquest testimony, Her feet were towards the gates, about six or seven feet from them. In other words, she was a good couple of metres within the yard. Now to my mind, Liz after being assaulted in the street would have gone kicking and screaming into Dutfileds with her assailant not just scream, not very loudly according to Schwartz. Yet nobody saw or heard her putting up a fight, nor is there any evidence that she did, in fact, the evidence points the other way, yes those damned cachous etc
This is what Schwartz said, The man tried to pull the woman into the street. Does that sound like a killer who then goes on to kill Liz in a darkened passageway, swiftly and silently? Not for me. Not only that but he draws attention to himself by shouting Lipski, and even if we surmise that he did this to scare Schwartz off how would he know that someone else, Fanny Mortimer, for instance, wouldn't come to her door to see what the commotion was and witnessed him? But of course, the cry of Lipski aimed at a man of strong Jewish appearance would almost certainly be thrown by a Gentile thus casting doubt on the IWEC being involved in the strong anti-Semitic climate.
Hi DK
I think he may have cut her throat in the street, fled and Stride then tried to make her way to the voices (and help) in the club but expired in the yard.
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  #65  
Old 09-18-2018, 06:35 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
Stride then tried to make her way to the voices (and help) in the club but expired in the yard.
I get that impression as well, Abby. There's a possibility that she wouldn't have died (or even lost consciousness) instantly, owing to the nature of the wound, which may have given her a time to make her way into the yard herself.
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  #66  
Old 09-18-2018, 06:44 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
I get that impression as well, Abby. There's a possibility that she wouldn't have died (or even lost consciousness) instantly, owing to the nature of the wound, which may have given her a time to make her way into the yard herself.
Thanks Sam
agree. it would explain alot of things.
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"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

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  #67  
Old 09-18-2018, 10:05 AM
richardnunweek richardnunweek is offline
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Hi
Surely no blood was found in the street area. and appears to have only been in the yard.
Regards Richard.
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  #68  
Old 09-18-2018, 10:30 AM
Observer Observer is offline
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Originally Posted by richardnunweek View Post
Hi
Surely no blood was found in the street area. and appears to have only been in the yard.
Regards Richard.
Indeed Richard. Doctor Blackwell, and Doctor Philips were in no doubt that Liz Stride was murdered where she lay. Both searched for blood stains other than the stream of blood which extended from her neck down to the gutter, and could find none.
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  #69  
Old 09-18-2018, 11:02 AM
Wickerman Wickerman is online now
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Originally Posted by Robert St Devil View Post

I cant rightfully say why Jack the Ripper undid the tops of these women's dresses,; however, since the pattern appears in both places, it would seem like a similar hand was evident, judging by the opened dresses. In the case of Stride, I've been wondering if Jack the Ripper put his hand inside of her dress, causing that blood-stained abrasion under her right arm.
I've always been partial to the idea that Jack used a ligature/cord to strangle his victims (Dr. Brownfield's theory)
The difference between a top button being undone or being torn open may be nothing more than the difference between a tight or loose fitting top button.

I wouldn't rule out the victim being responsible for this, in a desperate attempt to remove the ligature. There doesn't seem to be a rationale need for the killer to do that, unless he was looking for a necklace?
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  #70  
Old 09-18-2018, 11:05 AM
Bridewell Bridewell is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry D View Post

Stride's throat was cut less than an hour before a Ripper-esque murder. Sure, the timing is convenient, but life is full of strange coincidences. The Ripper case certainly isn't an exception to happenstance, e.g. Eddowes giving the same name to the police as the next victim, and Sarah Brown having her throat cut in a domestic on the night of the Double Event.
And Elizabeth Long's appearance at the Chapman inquest being followed by the murder of a woman nicknamed Long Liz.
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