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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Non-Canonical Victims > Torso Killings

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  #1  
Old 12-04-2018, 04:12 AM
Batman Batman is offline
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Default JtR failed amputation. Torso killer was successful.

Seems this could be a very big strike against JtR being the Torso killer(s).

Kelly's amputated breasts by circular incisions demonstrate that JtR tried to amputate body parts. Her right arm was slightly abducted. Also, there are knife knotches found more than once on their vertebrates. Many of JtR's victim's heads are almost severed from their body.

Even if we debate if he was amputating, there is evidence he tried to do something, stopped and didn't follow through, especially with Kelly.

It seems these points jeopardize both attempts to give JtR some medical training and to associate him with the Torso murderer, who seems to have no problem with severing body parts and amputating them. For JtR, this is a problem and time limits can't be a factor, given we know with Kelly, he had lots of uninterrupted time to carry out his fantasies to the full.
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Old 12-04-2018, 04:57 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Good points, although I should point out that "abducted" was being used in a technical sense. It simply meant that the arm was lying at a slight angle to the torso, as opposed to being flush with the side. If you place your arms at your sides and then lift them away, you are "abducting" them.
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Old 12-04-2018, 06:17 AM
John G John G is offline
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Very good points, Batman. Particularly, as regards the Kelly case, where he would have had time to perform the decapitation ritual etc.
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Old 12-04-2018, 07:18 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batman View Post
Seems this could be a very big strike against JtR being the Torso killer(s).

Kelly's amputated breasts by circular incisions demonstrate that JtR tried to amputate body parts. Her right arm was slightly abducted. Also, there are knife knotches found more than once on their vertebrates. Many of JtR's victim's heads are almost severed from their body.

Even if we debate if he was amputating, there is evidence he tried to do something, stopped and didn't follow through, especially with Kelly.

It seems these points jeopardize both attempts to give JtR some medical training and to associate him with the Torso murderer, who seems to have no problem with severing body parts and amputating them. For JtR, this is a problem and time limits can't be a factor, given we know with Kelly, he had lots of uninterrupted time to carry out his fantasies to the full.
Hi Batman
Nahhh. . Torsoman seemed to be keeping parts-external as well as internal parts.

The ripper (if he was also torsoman)couldn't very well take away a human head or leg or arm away from one of his victims very easily.

so he just went with internal parts he wanted for the ripper kills.
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Old 12-04-2018, 07:24 AM
Fisherman Fisherman is online now
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I don´t think he wanted to decapitate the Ripper victims at all, least of all Kelly. I think it was of the utmost importance to him that her head was in place.

He cut savagely and all the way down to the bone. How could the vertebrae NOT be nicked, considering this?
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Old 12-04-2018, 07:50 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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I don´t think he wanted to decapitate the Ripper victims at all, least of all Kelly. I think it was of the utmost importance to him that her head was in place
A practised dismemberer could have cut off her head and left it behind, posed in an appropriately macabre tableau. Along with other severed limbs, if the fancy took him.
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Old 12-04-2018, 07:55 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fisherman View Post
I don´t think he wanted to decapitate the Ripper victims at all, least of all Kelly. I think it was of the utmost importance to him that her head was in place.

He cut savagely and all the way down to the bone. How could the vertebrae NOT be nicked, considering this?
Hi fish

Quote:
I don´t think he wanted to decapitate the Ripper victims at all, least of all Kelly. I think it was of the utmost importance to him that her head was in place.

why pray tell?
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Old 12-04-2018, 07:59 AM
Fisherman Fisherman is online now
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Hi fish




why pray tell?
Because if it was not in place,I don´t think the killer would have produced what he set out to do, Abby. It would be as if Michelangelo carved his Pietá with the left arms missing from Maria and Jesus.
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Old 12-04-2018, 08:25 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
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Because if it was not in place,I don´t think the killer would have produced what he set out to do, Abby. It would be as if Michelangelo carved his Pietá with the left arms missing from Maria and Jesus.
so it was more important to torsoripper what he left behind, than what he took?

hes creating works of art in what he left?

whats the significance then for what he took (the body parts, internal organs)???
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"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

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Old 12-04-2018, 08:01 AM
Darryl Kenyon Darryl Kenyon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fisherman View Post
I don´t think he wanted to decapitate the Ripper victims at all, least of all Kelly. I think it was of the utmost importance to him that her head was in place.
May i ask why Fish
Sorry i see the question has been asked.
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