Why Didn't the Police Have Schwartz and/or Lawende Take a Look at Hutchinson?

[Fisherman]

MrBarnett

Fish,

He says if Maxwell was wrong, then Hutch was probably wrong.

He writes "And if Mrs. Maxwell was mistaken, is it not probable that George Hutchison erred also?"

I think it is just a way of phrasing the idea that if one could be wrong, that opens up for the possibility that the other can too.

If he’s just making the point that anyone can make a mistake, then why not Cox? Why does he link Maxwell and Hutch?

Because they were of the same ilk, I´d say - witnesses that were strong and reliable and who would not be expected to get things wrong. Cox was somebody Dew seemingly was a lot less impressed with. And Cox was right on the day, as proven by how others heard Kelly sing too, just as Cox did. Plus she had the weather right.

He explains why he believes Maxwell got her days wrong - because her account is contradicted by the medical evidence - but he gives no explanation for why he doubts Hutch, other than for some reason linking his evidence to Maxwells.

True, he does not say why it was decided that Hutch had made an error - but he does lay down that he DID err in some manner. Reasonably, it´s all about Lewis´ testimony and a comparison made to that.

And having dismissed Hutch’s evidence The Man Who Caught Crippen fingers blotchy as the only remaining option.

Not really, no. He simply says that Blotchy was his favoured suspect and he adds that he thinks Kelly died at around the time when he was there. It is a time that dovetails with Bonds suggested TOD and so Dew may have thought Bond reliable in this aspect.
But just as you imply, it is abundantly clear that Dew did NOT allow for Astrakhan man being linked to the murder night.

[Sam Flynn]

An ex potato porter?

Jack the Chipper

[Batman]

An ex potato porter?

Obviously, there is no major obstacle for a fish porter to bring home potatoes with some fish.

I doubt MJK kept her kippers and potatoes in the fridge.

She dinned just before she was murdered. A fact of the matter. She had eaten food that wasn't even fully digested by the time JtR was ripping into her.

[MrBarnett]

Obviously, there is no major obstacle for a fish porter to bring home potatoes with some fish.

I doubt MJK kept her kippers and potatoes in the fridge.

She dinned just before she was murdered. A fact of the matter. She had eaten food that wasn't even fully digested by the time JtR was ripping into her.

From memory Barnett was asked if he gave Kelly any money the last time he saw her and he said no. He went on to say that when he had been earning he had frequently brought home treats such as meat. If he had presented her with the wherewithal for a fish and chip supper, I think he would have mentioned it.

[Sam Flynn]

Obviously, there is no major obstacle for a fish porter to bring home potatoes with some fish.

She was seen entering her room with a blotchy-faced man who'd bought a quart pot of beer and brought it along. I wouldn't be surprised if Mr Blotchy, or some other customer, had bought her food as well as drink that night.

[Batman]

From memory Barnett was asked if he gave Kelly any money the last time he saw her and he said no. He went on to say that when he had been earning he had frequently brought home treats such as meat. If he had presented her with the wherewithal for a fish and chip supper, I think he would have mentioned it.

If she went to get a supper, then we should have some evidence of witnesses to this. We know investigators followed up on shop and pub visits.

So it appears someone brought her the food and within a few hours of eating it, she was being eviscerated.

Two people are seen carrying items to her room.

Blotchy with Cox claiming he had a can of beer and Hutchinson claiming his man had a small parcel in his left hand, with a kind of strap round it.

Where was the empty can of beer at Kelly's place? So Blotchy (who was never found it seems) took it away again.

Out of both those packages which one is more likely to be fish and chips?

I go for the small parcel with the strap because it's hot.

[Sam Flynn]

Out of both those packages which one is more likely to be fish and chips?

I go for the small parcel with the strap because it's hot.

I've not known anyone to wrap their fish and chips in linseed-oil impregnated linen, secured with a strap.

[Sam Flynn]

Where was the empty can of beer at Kelly's place?

We're not talking about disposable cans of beer, more like a reusable vessel of one's own which could be taken to a pub or shop to be refilled. There was nothing odd in Blotchy taking it away with him after he and Kelly had emptied it... assuming it was empty, of course, and didn't contain a heart, say.

[Batman]

I've not known anyone to wrap their fish and chips in linseed-oil impregnated linen, secured with a strap.

Why must that be the material used in the small parcel and not say... paper?

[Darryl Kenyon]

I feel there is a chance that Mary had left the items cooking before she went out. Large fire, Tin Bath used as Kettle of fish IE in water. Potatoes whole in the fire [like on bonfire night when I was a kid].

[Batman]

Where are the Chandlery shops heading towards Dorset St., from Commercial Street?

You know this overall direction that Hutchinson describes is from the geographic profile hot zone towards Dorset Street for the murder.

[Joshua Rogan]

We're not talking about disposable cans of beer, more like a reusable vessel of one's own which could be taken to a pub or shop to be refilled. There was nothing odd in Blotchy taking it away with him after he and Kelly had emptied it... assuming it was empty, of course, and didn't contain a heart, say.

The Echo 13 Nov thought it was odd;

"The statement that the man who accompanied Kelly home was carrying a pot of beer is considered somewhat extraordinary. The can or pot which contained the liquor was not found in the room, and a careful examination of the fireplace and ashes showed that it had not been melted down, as was at first considered probable. If, therefore, the beer was actually taken into the house as described the man must have taken it away with him. This would seem to show that the man, if he were the murderer, feared the can might form a link in a possible chain of evidence against him, and by consequence that he, and not the woman, entered the tavern and bought and paid for the liquor. As far as inquiries have gone, no man answering the description given by Cox entered any tavern in the immediate neighbourhood and took away beer. There is a beershop at the corner of Dorset-street, but, according to information furnished within a few hours of the discovery of the murder, the woman Kelly did not have any drink in the house on the previous night."

"The beer can incident is being inquired into. Though there is no reason to doubt the accuracy of Mary Anne Cox's testimony - it was this witness who saw the man carrying a beer can while accompanying the deceased to her home at midnight - it is a remarkable thing that the can was not discovered in the room. It is not now believed for a moment that the murderer took it away with him. The only other explanation is this: - In the lowest parts of the East-end, as in other districts of ill-repute, it is the practice of women of the unfortunate class to take beer home with them at night, and then place the cans outside their doors. These are collected by potmen in the morning. Inquiries are now being made by Inspector Moore, Inspector Beck, and Detective-sergeant Thicke as to whether any potman in the district collected a can from outside Kelly's room."

[MrBarnett]

Why must that be the material used in the small parcel and not say... paper?

Hutch said he thought the parcel was wrapped in American cloth.

[Sam Flynn]

The Echo 13 Nov thought it was odd

Strange. Even people of my parents' generation would take their own vessels to the shop or the milk cart if they wanted to buy some And, more recently, I've known people come into my own local pub to fill up a plastic canister with beer to take away. Perhaps that wasn't the done thing back in 1888, but I'm not convinced.

Interesting report, though. Evidently some people were looking on Mr Blotchy with suspicion, and I can't see I blame them.

[Sam Flynn]

Where are the Chandlery shops heading towards Dorset St., from Commercial Street?

I touched on this a little earlier:

We know from the Tabram case that fish'n'chips could be bought from a chandlers' shop in Thrawl Street until well past 1AM.