Why do we know so little about Diemshitz?

[Chris Scott]

I have never been able to find any census or BMD (Birth, marriage and death) record of Lewis Diemshitz (or under any of the various variant spellings) nor can I find any mention in the London Gazette to suggest that he changed his name legally.
Immigration and emigration lists have drawn a blank.
The only official record I know of are the court and press reports of the case he and Kozebrodski were involved in and the subsequent furore over the sentence.

Has anyone ever found an official listing of this man or his wife?
Thanks for the help
Chris

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Chris. Many anarchists and socialists didn't trust the census, so I'm not surprised you can't find him. I'm also not sure how long he was in London. Some of his fellow IWEC members moved to the states (New York and New Jersey specifically) so it's possible Louis did as well.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Chris Scott]

Hi Tom
many thanks for the note.

As the only official record, below is the list of relevant entries in the Criminal Register relating to the incident in 1889 outside the Berner Street Club.
This lists not only Diemshitz and Kozebrodski but also a man named Samuel Friedman who was obviously invoved in the same fracas.

The entries read as follows:

County of London (north Side of the Thames)
Return of All Persons Committed or Bailed to Appear for Trial or Indicted at the Adjourned Quarter Sessions held at Clerkenwell on the 23rd day of April, 1889 showing the nature of their offences and the result of the proceedings.


Name: LEWIS DIEMSHITZ
Offences: Assault on police whilst in execution of duty and assault with intent to prevent arrest
Sentence: 3 months Imprisonment and own recognisances in £40 and 2 sureties in £20 to keep the peace for 12 calendar months

Name: SAMUEL FRIEDMAN
Offences: The like (i.e. the same as Diemshitz)
Sentence: Did not surrender. Bench Warrant issued

Name: ISAAC KOZEBRODSKI
Offences: The like
Sentence: Fined £4 or in default 1 calendar month's imprisonment

[Tom_Wescott]

Attention Adam Went

Thanks for that, Chris. I've got Ripperologist's resident Stride expert insinuating that I'm making up the fact that his last name is Diemshitz and not Diemschutz as generally thought.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Chris Scott]

This shows that Samuel Friedman was indeed involved in the same case

Reynold's Newspaper
24 March 1889

[The Grave Maurice]

I think most of us can agree that his name was, in fact, Diemshitz; but Diemshutz is so ingrained in our collective memory that many of us will probably go on calling him that. Does it make that much difference? It's like when we learned that Charles Cross was actually Charles Lechmere. Interesting, but of no real consequence as far as the facts of the case are concerned. Let's just make sure we all know whom we're talking about in a given situation.

[Chris]

Marvellous stuff. Israel Sunshine and Emanuel Snapper. Not to mention Inspector Thresher ...

[The Grave Maurice]

"You say tomato, and I say tomato,
You say potato, and I say potato,
Tomato, tomato,
Potato, pota....

I'm sorry, I just can't see the problem with this relationship."

--Eleanor Bron

[Stephen Thomas]

This shows that Samuel Friedman was indeed involved in the same case

Reynold's Newspaper
24 March 1889

What on earth is a cap blocker?

[Chris Scott]

Hi Stephen
Only a guess but I'd imagine a "cap blocker" was a maker of caps (as in headgear) on a wooden block as a former, or the guy who actually made those blocks.
I know some traditional forms of headgear such or bowlers (aka derbys) are still made by steaming them over expandable wooden blocks so I imagine caps maybe were made in the same way on occasion
But, I must stress, this is only a guess

PS I've just found another entry from the 1891 census where a man listed as cap blocker is also described as a hatter, so I think a maker of headgear seems to be right

[Tom_Wescott]

I think most of us can agree that his name was, in fact, Diemshitz; but Diemshutz is so ingrained in our collective memory that many of us will probably go on calling him that. Does it make that much difference? It's like when we learned that Charles Cross was actually Charles Lechmere. Interesting, but of no real consequence as far as the facts of the case are concerned. Let's just make sure we all know whom we're talking about in a given situation.

No, it's not a big deal if someone such as yourself, who enjoys the case and the socializing, but doesn't take it all that seriously as a historical pursuit, prefers to call him Diemschutz on the boards. I would prefer to do so myself, but I don't have that privelege because I chose to publish on the topic. If you choose to add to the literature of a subject you have a higher responsibility towards accuracy, which is what I'm hoping Adam will come to understand.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

P.S. Charles Cross went by that name, so it's historically accurate, whereas Diemshitz never called himself 'Diemschutz'.

[The Grave Maurice]

Yikes. Do they send out a packet of pompous pills for every manuscript you submit? We're talking about a variant vowel here. It is what one of my history professors used to call a cul-de-sac: if it doesn't lead anywhere, forget it and turn around.

Oh, I almost forgot....

[cappuccina]

There is also the third variant of his name..."Deimschitz"....found here...



Actually, no one knows for certain which spelling is correct, so the "posturing" that one is going to use a certain spelling because that is for certain the correct one, and thus somehow gives the "author" more "street cred" is quite amusing.

The issue with the spelling of Mr. D's last name is very similar to what happened with many immigrant folks who came to America through Ellis Island and ended up with a multitude of spelling variants of their last name...My grandfather's original last name has at least 6 different spellings, and we still do not know for certain which one is correct, because he came from a country that uses a completely different alphabet, and we have no records from over there with his name actually written; thus we cannot translate it to get the "best" or the "correct" spelling. He had one spelling of his last name at Ellis Island, a slightly different one on the census, and slightly different one than those two on his draft card, etc. His borther who came over with him, had a slightly different spelling than all of the above vis a vis his last name on the ship's manifest, so you can see how you cannot "pick" the right one...

(GM... )

[cappuccina]

Oh, and actually, since most Polish or Russian Jews with this last name came from Vitebsk in what is now Belarus, it is more likely that his name would have been spelled Dimschitz, as that is how the majority of the folks who emigrated from there spelled their last name, or at least the English phonetic translation for the majority of the folks coming from there was "Dimschitz" anyway...

See what I mean?

[Tom_Wescott]

Yikes. Do they send out a packet of pompous pills for every manuscript you submit? We're talking about a variant vowel here. It is what one of my history professors used to call a cul-de-sac: if it doesn't lead anywhere, forget it and turn around.

Your professor was correct, but he was speaking in terms of dead ends, which does not apply in this case, since the documentation is there. It was a very short road in fact to anyone curious enough to look. Only in Ripperology do people get ridiculed for discovery and the correction of errors. I've never stated it was a 'big deal', but surely it's more pompous of you to suggest that I should know something but choose to play ignorant and keep using an incorrect spelling? Do you think that would make sense to most people? Apparently, if it's deemed a 'minor' correction, such as the spelling of a name, it's laughable and not worth bringing up. Thank God Adam, Grave, and Caps represent the minority view or else we'd still be suffering from what I call 'Buck's Row Beatlemania', where Charles Cross and Robert Paul were originally George Cross and John Paul.

There is also the third variant of his name..."Deimschitz"....found here...

If you go by the press, ther'es about 12 variations, and all but one end in 'shitz' or 'schitz', only the Times in 'Schutz'. That's what first tipped me off and made me look at more reliable documents.

Actually, no one knows for certain which spelling is correct

Perhaps you're right about that, but what we do know is that it's spelled 'Diemschutz' only in the Times, and a variation of 'Diemshitz' in all other papers. We also know that more reliable documents such as those emanating from the IWEC and legal documents, such as the one presented by Chris Scott here, without exception, spell it 'Diemshitz'. The evidence is therefore overwhelming. It will probably be 10 years but eventually the books will get it right.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott