Did the Ripper live in Goulston Street

[dixon9]

sorry i seem to asking to many questions (but am really enjoying it on here),after PC Long found the apron in Goulston Street did the police do any house to house inquiries in the area?


sorry if it is a silly question which has been answered numerous times

[Scott Nelson]

Yes, they did. And yes, the Ripper did (possibly) live on Goulston street.

Young Simon Delafuente (aged 15) living at 116 Goulston St probably wrote the graffito in the early evening before the murder, but only as a lark. Thank goodness the police didn't question this family too closely during the search of the building.

[dixon9]

thank you scott

[JTRSickert]

Hey Dixon,

If you saw the recent documentary "JTR: A killer revealed" they had a modern geographic profiler say that he more than likely lived around Dorset Street or Flower & Dean Street.

Also, one other reason I don't think he lived in Goulston Street is because Goulston was adjacent to Middlesex Street (as it is today) and, at the time, Middlesex street was where Jewish merchants conducted business and they mostly lived in Goulston Street. And, in my opinion, I don't think JTR was a Jew. Also, do you think he would be foolsih enough to drop the bloody apron piece in the very street where he lived? I'd like to give him more credit than that.

[dixon9]

thanks JTR

[perrymason]

Some folks have wondered aloud why the killer of Mitre Square would drop off the organs and then later take the apron section that likely carried them back outside...whether he lived on Goulston or not.

Sam raised his concerns that the cloth represented little threat to him in and of itself stuffed in his pocket...or he could have left it with the organs, stuffed it in a trash bin, burned it...or chose any old way of disposing of it that didnt require a trip out again.

If the apron didnt arrive at its location until almost 70 minutes after Kates murder....which is when it is first seen by anyone other than Kates killer...then his "placement" of the cloth as a confirmation of the messenger is a valid concept....and bloody likely considering "blame" featured prominently in the message...its the only self explanatory part of it.

You may want to consider also that this was 4 or 5 lines that could have easily been written in 1 or 2 lines. Why?

Adequate spacing for ensuring clarity and readability is my guess. It was in "good schoolboy" handwriting....neat and meant to be read easily.

Cheers all.

[Versa]

Hey Dixon,

If you saw the recent documentary "JTR: A killer revealed" they had a modern geographic profiler say that he more than likely lived around Dorset Street or Flower & Dean Street.

Also, one other reason I don't think he lived in Goulston Street is because Goulston was adjacent to Middlesex Street (as it is today) and, at the time, Middlesex street was where Jewish merchants conducted business and they mostly lived in Goulston Street. And, in my opinion, I don't think JTR was a Jew. Also, do you think he would be foolsih enough to drop the bloody apron piece in the very street where he lived? I'd like to give him more credit than that.

I agree that he was probably very close to home when he lost the piece of apron but I don't think he 'tossed it away' or discarded it on purpose, I think it more likely it got stuck to his clothing and fell off or came out of a pocket accidentally and fell where it was found....

[Fleetwood Mac]

How about this:

Jack was heading back into Met territory. Due to the earlier murder he knew that there was a chance the place would be swarming with police and he may be stopped.

So, he needs to wipe his knife and steady himself.

He knows Wentworth Buildings well, and knows that he can step inside and out the back if spotted by anyone while cleaning his knife - gives him an escape route; or, he actually steps inside wipes his knife, re-emerges and discards the apron.

Only problem is: what about the organs?

[K-453]

I noticed the many little blue circles on the detailed map Rob Clack posted on the last page
here -> http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=1217&page=3

Public water fountains? If so, one of them is close to 108-119.

Or are they gas lamps?

[Monty]

Hydrants

Monty

[Barrister]

Hi

Was having a discussion with a friend recently about the Eddowes murder, and he came up with the following, might I add that I do not agree with him.

He theorises that the killer lived opposite the site in Goulston Street where the apron and message were found. His scenario goes something like this.

The killer decided to transport Eddowes Kidney and womb, in the portion of apron which he cut from her. He then fled the scene. He arrived at his abode in Goulston Street shortly before two o clock, he removed the kidney and womb from the apron. He was aware of the timings of PC Longs beat and as an afterthought to the killing he decided to write a message opposite his abode. Subsequently he waited until Long had left Goulston Street at 2:20 a.m. nipped out wrote the message, and dropped the apron piece next to the message. This is why Long failed to see the apron or message on his beat which had him in Goulston Street at 2:20 a.m.

Why leave such a clue so close to home? The killer reasoned that the police would never suspect someone living as close to the clue of the apron and message as he did. In short, he reasoned that the last place they would be searching for him would be in Goulston Street.

This is his theory, as I said I find it very unlikely, but he requested me to post it here, so here it is.

All the best

Observer

I am not sure where Jack lived but, at least at this stage, Goulston Street is the title of the novel I am writing about Jack and his malicious deeds.

[Batman]

Why leave such a clue so close to home?
All the best

Observer

Given the time gap between Eddowes murder and the dropping of the GSG apron it is not a bad speculation to say that JtR went home and did an after drop. Now why GSG for the drop?

1. Schwartz had encounterted JtR who blew him off with a racial slur 'Lipski' successfully. The fact he had disturbed him meant he had to move on.

2. Before killing Eddowes 3 Jews walk passed him close enough to get some sort of a look.

3. In prior weeks Chapman's murder had started a wave of anti-semitic violence/riots because of Leather Apron (Pizer).

So he went back out and dropped the apron by a street that he knew was a Jewish district and wrote and graffiti in double cockney blaming the Jews for what happened.

This is the closest evidence you can get in the case AGAINST a Jewish suspect.

Personally I find the evidence overwhelmingly in favor of a non-Jew who got on the anti-jew bandwagon to escape detection.

The alternative that it was a Jew planning that the police would not go after him for being a Jew in the area, must be considered a backfire then if one selects a Jewish suspect.

[Hatchett]

Hi,

It would seem plausable that whoever wrote the graffitti was talking about the inhabitants of the building.

[Scott Nelson]

Yes, now we're getting somewhere.

[Rosella]

I don't know whether Jack lived or had a bolt-hole actually in Goulston St. I do think it was probably nearby as the longer he had that filthy apron in his possession the shorter the odds of him being noticed or even stopped by a patrolling police officer. He probably knew when he left Mitre Square that Eddowes would be found fairly quickly and that numbers of both City and Met police would be around.

I don't think Jack was a 'non-Jew who got on the anti-Jewish bandwagon to escape detection. I think he was a non-jew who was anti-Semite on his own.

If you just examine the C-5 there are markers in three of the murders. Polly Nichols killed just south of a disused Jewish cemetery. Stride deposited so close to a Jewish working men's club there was only a wall between. Eddowes killed at Mitre Square near a Jewish social club.

And also part of her apron and the graffito placed at the entrance to a dwelling housing mostly Jews. He couldn't have been clearer in his object of dropping the apron there, and if you believe the graffiti was his, then he obviously hoped to provoke a riot or at least a fight between Jews and Gentiles.