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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Letters and Communications > Dear Boss Letter

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  #1  
Old 03-04-2012, 02:35 PM
Bridewell Bridewell is offline
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Default Use of "Buckled" To Denote Arrest

I have just read the thread started by Archaic on the use of the phrase "I am down on..." to indicate strong disapproval (in the "Dear Boss" & elsewhere).
Following on from that, what does everyone think of the use of the word "buckled", in the same letter, suggesting, from the context "arrest" or capture"? Has anyone ever seen or heard of its use anywhere else in this way? (Personally I have no recollection of seeing this word used to indicate arrest, except in the DB or, as here, in references to it).

If it's not used elsewhere with that meaning, should we be taking a closer look at Buckle Street and its residents for the writer of the DB? There are only 12 Buckle Streets on the UK mainland, 1 in Sale, 1 in Peterborough, 9 in or near Evesham & only 1 within 85 miles of London - just south of Whitechapel High Street.
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  #2  
Old 03-04-2012, 04:41 PM
Robert Robert is offline
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Hi Bridewell

The writer may not have meant anything so specific as "arrested" - he might simply have meant "beaten," "squashed" etc. However there is a modern usage of "busted" to indicate arrest or capture, so maybe you're on the right track.
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Old 03-04-2012, 05:08 PM
Robert Robert is offline
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"Buckled" occurred straight after the mention of Leather Apron, and it's interesting to note that "Buckle my shoe" was apparently rhyming slang for "Jew," though presumably it wouldn't make sense for someone to speak of being "Jewed."
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Old 03-04-2012, 05:16 PM
Hunter Hunter is offline
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In the way it was used in the letter, 'buckled' was American slang meaning that someone's opponent is closing in on them; just like a belt buckle is the connecting devive that holds a belt or strap around something.
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When evidence is not to be had, theories abound. Even the most plausible of them do not carry conviction- London Times Nov. 10.1888
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  #5  
Old 03-04-2012, 05:45 PM
Jon Guy Jon Guy is offline
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Hi Bridewell

I found these examples on Old Bailey Online.

From 1869:

CHRISTOPHER GOULD . (Police Sergeant C 14). I went to 43, Old Pye Street with Upson—I found Wythe in bed with a woman—I told him I should take him in custody for being concerned with Metcalfe in a burglary at, 19, Lisle Street—he said "Very well, it's rather warm"—I searched him, and found these two skeleton keys (produced), I tried one of those to the door of 19, Lisle Street, and it fitted—I found three other skeleton keys and a common door-key on the mantelshelf—on the way to the station he said, "You have buckled me to rights this time, but don't heap too much on me"—at the station Metcalfe said, "Will you tell me who gave you the information where to find us? Had we known that you were coming you


This from 1870:

WILLIAM HAYDON (Police Sergeant G). I went to 3, Leopards Court, where Ferguson lives, and assisted in searching the room—I found this pistol in the coal cupboard, on a shelf, loaded with ball cartridge and capped—I also found all these skeleton keys (produced), this jemmy and centrepiece, and these four bits and a file—they were altogether in a bag, between the boarding and the wall of the room—I found this small key in the bag—I took it to the prosecutor's house, and tried it to the door, and it fitted—I also found a mask in the bag with the pistol—I took Ferguson into custody, and charged him—he said "You have buckled me this time. I know I shall get a long term, give it me fair"—I took this jemmy down to the house in Great Queen Street, and compared it with the marks on the window, and they corresponded exactly in width.

This from 1877:

I first saw Froggatt on 4th December, at the corner of Southampton Row, with Meiklejohn, who said "Of course you know Benson is buckled"—I said "Yes, I heard it to-day"—buckled means arrested—


From 1893:

EDWARD KITCHEN (Detective S). On 8th June I was at Hendon Station when the prisoners were brought in—Shelton said, "It is a rare job to come down here and get buckled. "
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Old 03-04-2012, 06:11 PM
Robert Robert is offline
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Question answered!
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  #7  
Old 03-04-2012, 06:22 PM
Bridewell Bridewell is offline
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Default Cor Blimey, Guvnor!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Guy View Post
Hi Bridewell

I found these examples on Old Bailey Online.

From 1869:

CHRISTOPHER GOULD . (Police Sergeant C 14). I went to 43, Old Pye Street with Upson—I found Wythe in bed with a woman—I told him I should take him in custody for being concerned with Metcalfe in a burglary at, 19, Lisle Street—he said "Very well, it's rather warm"—I searched him, and found these two skeleton keys (produced), I tried one of those to the door of 19, Lisle Street, and it fitted—I found three other skeleton keys and a common door-key on the mantelshelf—on the way to the station he said, "You have buckled me to rights this time, but don't heap too much on me"—at the station Metcalfe said, "Will you tell me who gave you the information where to find us? Had we known that you were coming you


This from 1870:

WILLIAM HAYDON (Police Sergeant G). I went to 3, Leopards Court, where Ferguson lives, and assisted in searching the room—I found this pistol in the coal cupboard, on a shelf, loaded with ball cartridge and capped—I also found all these skeleton keys (produced), this jemmy and centrepiece, and these four bits and a file—they were altogether in a bag, between the boarding and the wall of the room—I found this small key in the bag—I took it to the prosecutor's house, and tried it to the door, and it fitted—I also found a mask in the bag with the pistol—I took Ferguson into custody, and charged him—he said "You have buckled me this time. I know I shall get a long term, give it me fair"—I took this jemmy down to the house in Great Queen Street, and compared it with the marks on the window, and they corresponded exactly in width.

This from 1877:

I first saw Froggatt on 4th December, at the corner of Southampton Row, with Meiklejohn, who said "Of course you know Benson is buckled"—I said "Yes, I heard it to-day"—buckled means arrested—


From 1893:

EDWARD KITCHEN (Detective S). On 8th June I was at Hendon Station when the prisoners were brought in—Shelton said, "It is a rare job to come down here and get buckled. "

Hi Jon,

Astonishing - & slightly embarrassing - that you found three examples so easily. If the intended meaning is "arrested", as in the Old Bailey examples, (which seems likely) I think a British author more likely than an American; if a journalist, perhaps one used to working as a court reporter?

Robert,

As you say - question answered. I'm intrigued by the idea of "Buckle My Shoe" being rhyming slang for Jew though:

"One two, buckle my shoe" = Jew.
"Three four, knock at the door" = Whore perhaps?!
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  #8  
Old 03-04-2012, 06:28 PM
Bridewell Bridewell is offline
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Have just quickly looked up "One two, buckle my shoe" (the nursery rhyme). It's suggested that the content relates to lace-making:

http://www.rhymes.org.uk/one_two_buckle_my_shoe.htm
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Old 03-04-2012, 08:13 PM
c.d. c.d. is offline
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I always thought "buckled" referred to handcuffs.

c.d.
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  #10  
Old 03-04-2012, 08:55 PM
lynn cates lynn cates is offline
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Default American

Hello Bridewell.

"If the intended meaning is "arrested", as in the Old Bailey examples, (which seems likely) I think a British author more likely than an American."

Of course, there's still "Boss" and "fix."

Cheers.
LC
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