The International Working Men's Club as a Place of Refuge?

[c.d.]

My apologies for another Stride thread. We probably need this about as much as the world needs more lawyers. We argue about whether Liz was soliciting or waiting for somebody but I now wonder if she considered the club a safe place from the unwanted attention of the BS man. If she had had some run in with him prior to being seen by Schwartz she might have sought out the club and stood nearby as if to say "if you don't leave me alone, I am going to pound on the door and scream for help and a dozen able bodied men will come to my rescue."

I seem to recall that the door to the club was locked. Can somebody confirm that? Even so, you would think that somebody inside would be listening for late arriving members. Would a pounding on the door simply be ignored?

There is testimony from those inside the club that they believe they would have heard a scream despite the singing. Yet, no one reports hearing anything.

So it would seem that Liz had a resource that she did not take advantage of or was it the case that getting help from club members was simply not practical for one reason or another?

c.d.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

Hullo c.d.

I see nothing wrong with another Stride thread. As far as a resource she could've used, she may have been unable to do so. Also, she very well may have been using it as a resource of a different sort. Me thinks a list of club members and guests for that evening ( other evenings as well) might shed some light on her murder. I wouldn't turn it away for damn sure.

[c.d.]

Hello Dig,

Thanks for your response. I was beginning to think that maybe everyone had o.d.'d on Liz.

As for her not using it as a resource, that's what seems so strange about it.

c.d.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

I never get tired of trying solve to mysteries

It's hard to ask for help when your throat is cut. And who knows if some anarchist socialists would move an inch anyways?

[c.d.]

I was thinking more of when she first perceived that she was in danger. And I would hope that the damsel in distress thing would apply socialist or no socialist.

c.d.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

Peharps

Stride had been soliciting outside the club and had no takers and was quite bothersome. So if there was a scream to be heard that was heard then none paid it any mind.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

Well

I was thinking more of when she first perceived that she was in danger. And I would hope that the damsel in distress thing would apply socialist or no socialist.

c.d.

It was apparently a common thing for people to mind their own business. As the cry of murder was heard often apparently and people didn't tend to do to much about it. Fear and apathy are a strong cocktail.

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

possible example

If he is to be believed, IS buggered off and didn't bother to even find a constable. Fear and apathy.

[lynn cates]

story

Hello CD. Thanks for starting this thread.

"We argue about whether Liz was soliciting or waiting for somebody but I now wonder if she considered the club a safe place from the unwanted attention of the BS man."

You are suggesting, I suppose, that she KNEW he was heading that way, or would be shortly?

"If she had had some run in with him prior to being seen by Schwartz she might have sought out the club and stood nearby as if to say "if you don't leave me alone, I am going to pound on the door and scream for help and a dozen able bodied men will come to my rescue.""

Very well. But why was she even in THAT neighbourhood?

"I seem to recall that the door to the club was locked. Can somebody confirm that? Even so, you would think that somebody inside would be listening for late arriving members. Would a pounding on the door simply be ignored?"

That was my understanding as well. If someone had pounded on the door, there should have been enough people downstairs to have heard it and opened.

"There is testimony from those inside the club that they believe they would have heard a scream despite the singing. Yet, no one reports hearing anything.

Quite.

"So it would seem that Liz had a resource that she did not take advantage of or was it the case that getting help from club members was simply not practical for one reason or another?"

Well, you know the testimony as well as anyone. Israel said (through an interpreter) that BSM was headed south down Berner and from Commercial. He accosted her. Etc.

No talk about her being pursued.

Now, given that I think you like ALL the Liz sightings (feel free to correct me if wrong), ten minutes before she was chatting with a bloke when seen by PC Smith. And just a few moments before this (nearly the same time) she was just south of the club brushing off some chap and talking about another night.

Story doesn't feel right.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

seekers

Hello DLDW.

"Me thinks a list of club members and guests for that evening ( other evenings as well) might shed some light on her murder. I wouldn't turn it away for damn sure."

Ah! Some Casebookers have been seeking such for years.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

to the rescue

Hello (again) DLDW.

"And who knows if some anarchist socialists would move an inch anyways?"

I've researched these chaps fairly well. They would have helped--unless overcome with fear.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

danger

Hello CD.

"I was thinking more of when she first perceived that she was in danger."

OK. When was that, do you think? When he began to converse, perhaps speaking in a rough tone?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

So say you all?

Hello (again) DLDW.

"Stride had been soliciting outside the club and had no takers and was quite bothersome. So if there was a scream to be heard that was heard then none paid it any mind."

But ALL in the club denied having seen her--well, at least those interviewed.

Cheers.
LC

[Digalittledeeperwatson]

Hullo Lynn

Hello (again) DLDW.

"Stride had been soliciting outside the club and had no takers and was quite bothersome. So if there was a scream to be heard that was heard then none paid it any mind."

But ALL in the club denied having seen her--well, at least those interviewed.

Cheers.
LC

Let's say she was soliciting and bothersome and then ends up dead on your doorstep. It's not a stretch to think those who did see her when asked would not admit it. Or perhaps she had serviced someone? Who the hell is going to admit to it? Mouths remaining shut isn't a terribly difficult thing to imagine.

[lynn cates]

duplicity

Hello DLDW. Thanks.

"Let's say she was soliciting and bothersome and then ends up dead on your doorstep. It's not a stretch to think those who did see her when asked would not admit it."

Quite. So you're saying the club may have engaged in a bit of duplicity to save their own hides? Hmm, singing my song.

Cheers.
LC