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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Social Chat > Shades of Whitechapel

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  #31  
Old 01-07-2019, 09:28 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerryd View Post
From the Eyraud wiki:

He noted in his autopsy report that the naked body was bound with seven meters of rope, the head was enveloped in a black oilskin cloth and that the victim had obviously died by strangulation three to five weeks before.


In the four cases attributed to the Thames Torso killer [1887-1889], the head was removed, never to be found. I have to say, though, if we include the 1884 Tottenham Court case in the mix, the head was recovered in that case.
thanks Jerry!
as usual your input with all things torso much appreciated.
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  #32  
Old 01-08-2019, 03:40 AM
Harry D Harry D is offline
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Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
Indeed and, had he been more successful in finding suitable opportunities to kill, I daresay we'd have seen rather more than five "blitzed" victims during that short period. Even as things stand, it sure looks like the Ripper had a greedy demon to feed, an appetite seemingly absent from the torso cases.
Quite right, Sam, and this is one of the major obstacles I have with the single killer theory. The Ripper had a voracious appetite for murder. He killed within a few months and kept to the same neck of the woods, even with its heightened police presence. Are we supposed to accept that the Ripper got this out of his system and went back to dumping the odd torso?
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  #33  
Old 01-08-2019, 04:36 AM
Fisherman Fisherman is offline
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Quite right, Sam, and this is one of the major obstacles I have with the single killer theory. The Ripper had a voracious appetite for murder. He killed within a few months and kept to the same neck of the woods, even with its heightened police presence. Are we supposed to accept that the Ripper got this out of his system and went back to dumping the odd torso?
DeAngelo got it out of his system. Rader got it out of his system. Jeffrey Gorton got it out of his system.

..but the Ripper could not do so? He was different in this context?

Care to explain why, Harry? You have taken a look at what he did and concluded that he would never stop, he would go on and on?

Have you noticed that there was 25 days between Tabram and Nichols, 8 days between Nichols and Chapman, 22 days between Chapman and Stride/Eddowes - and 39 days between Stride/Eddowes and Kelly? It seems he was winding down? Should he not increase the speed instead, to fit with your take on things?

Once more, if we accept that there was just the one killer, there are matters that seem unexpected to a smaller or larger degree.

But since we have no real choice but to accept that there was just the one killer, the question we should ask ourselves is whether these matters are unbridgeable or not.

And if you can show me an unbridgeable such matter, I will admit that there will have been two killers - or more.

The timings of the Ripper murders is no such factor. He may have felt it had become too risky (which could also explain why the Kelly murder lagged behind), he may have decided it didn't give him what he was after or anything else. There are possible explanations.

Is there any matter where no possible explanations can be offered, Harry? Or?

Last edited by Fisherman : 01-08-2019 at 04:42 AM.
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  #34  
Old 01-08-2019, 05:01 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Originally Posted by Harry D View Post
The Ripper... killed within a few months and kept to the same neck of the woods, even with its heightened police presence.
The underlined is a very cogent observation. A mobile eviscerating killer could easily have found other hunting grounds during this period of high police presence, and the fact that he didn't speaks volumes about how tied to this one small locale he was.
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  #35  
Old 01-08-2019, 05:32 AM
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caz caz is offline
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We could also look at this the other way round, Gareth. Assuming the ripper was operating within his own acceptable comfort zone, anywhere else may have been off limits to him psychologically. He surely didn't lack the mobility to walk beyond 'this one small locale' easily enough, if the pavements immediately beneath his feet had become too hot for him. Or are we looking for someone with arthritic legs? As I have so often said, if his feet weren't nailed to the floor [or his hands 'tied' to a lamppost], something else kept him killing where - and when - the police presence was already steadily increasing.

After the double event, the indoor murder of MJK may have been a last gasp for him before his comfort zone had become more of a discomfort zone.

Love,

Caz
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  #36  
Old 01-08-2019, 05:53 AM
Fisherman Fisherman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
The underlined is a very cogent observation. A mobile eviscerating killer could easily have found other hunting grounds during this period of high police presence, and the fact that he didn't speaks volumes about how tied to this one small locale he was.
Chose to be. Not "was", unless he was crippled.

It all fits nicely with somebody having a reason to pass through the territory on foot on a daily basis, I´d say. Wouldn't you agree?
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  #37  
Old 01-08-2019, 05:54 AM
Fisherman Fisherman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caz View Post
We could also look at this the other way round, Gareth. Assuming the ripper was operating within his own acceptable comfort zone, anywhere else may have been off limits to him psychologically. He surely didn't lack the mobility to walk beyond 'this one small locale' easily enough, if the pavements immediately beneath his feet had become too hot for him. Or are we looking for someone with arthritic legs? As I have so often said, if his feet weren't nailed to the floor [or his hands 'tied' to a lamppost], something else kept him killing where - and when - the police presence was already steadily increasing.

After the double event, the indoor murder of MJK may have been a last gasp for him before his comfort zone had become more of a discomfort zone.

Love,

Caz
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You should go talk to Harry, who feels the killer would never, ever have stopped!
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  #38  
Old 01-08-2019, 07:18 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is online now
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Originally Posted by Fisherman View Post
DeAngelo got it out of his system. Rader got it out of his system. Jeffrey Gorton got it out of his system.

..but the Ripper could not do so? He was different in this context?

Care to explain why, Harry? You have taken a look at what he did and concluded that he would never stop, he would go on and on?

Have you noticed that there was 25 days between Tabram and Nichols, 8 days between Nichols and Chapman, 22 days between Chapman and Stride/Eddowes - and 39 days between Stride/Eddowes and Kelly? It seems he was winding down? Should he not increase the speed instead, to fit with your take on things?

Once more, if we accept that there was just the one killer, there are matters that seem unexpected to a smaller or larger degree.

But since we have no real choice but to accept that there was just the one killer, the question we should ask ourselves is whether these matters are unbridgeable or not.

And if you can show me an unbridgeable such matter, I will admit that there will have been two killers - or more.

The timings of the Ripper murders is no such factor. He may have felt it had become too risky (which could also explain why the Kelly murder lagged behind), he may have decided it didn't give him what he was after or anything else. There are possible explanations.

Is there any matter where no possible explanations can be offered, Harry? Or?
and six months between Kelly and McKenzie
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"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #39  
Old 01-08-2019, 08:36 AM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
and six months between Kelly and McKenzie
Just underlines how unlikely it is McKenzie was a Ripper victim.
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  #40  
Old 01-08-2019, 08:39 AM
Harry D Harry D is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fisherman View Post
You should go talk to Harry, who feels the killer would never, ever have stopped!
But according to the single killer theory he didn't stop. He went from dumping the occasional torso over fifteen years, to a twelve week frenzy in 1888, and back again?
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