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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Non-Canonical Victims > Torso Killings

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  #11  
Old 10-14-2010, 02:21 PM
Debra A Debra A is offline
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I never suggested every single one merely offering an alternative view. Sadly alternative views seem to be what people dont want to hear.

Dont forget the mortality rate was high and there were many persons within those age parameters dying of various causes at that time. Phnemonia or how ever you spell it wouldnt show any outward symptons of death and not all would have been made the subject of post mortems as is still the case today.
Alternative views are always welcomed if they are relevant.

But we are talking specifically here of the four torso murders, the finding of the remains mapped here by protohistorian.
These were all females between the ages of 25 and 45, all dismembered and found between 1887 and 1889. Detailed post mortem notes, including examination of remaining internal organs were all done on these four. I'd expect doctors to be able to determine the cause of death of at least one of these women if they had died from disease in the workhouse or whatever and their bodies given over as anatomical specimens. No diseased organs were found in any of the cases to account for cause of death.

Perhaps other body parts found were dumped for the reasons you state.There was another arm found at the time of the 1888 case and a thigh in the 1887 case, but no one is proposing these as victims.

No other dismembered corpses were found in the Thames or surrounding areas in this particular time period, why just these four women?
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Last edited by Debra A : 10-14-2010 at 02:26 PM. Reason: spelling
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  #12  
Old 10-14-2010, 02:51 PM
Trevor Marriott Trevor Marriott is offline
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I never suggested every single one merely offering an alternative view. Sadly alternative views seem to be what people dont want to hear.

Dont forget the mortality rate was high and there were many persons within those age parameters dying of various causes at that time. Phnemonia or how ever you spell it wouldnt show any outward symptons of death and not all would have been made the subject of post mortems as is still the case today.
Must not also forget suicides !!!!!!!!!!!!
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  #13  
Old 10-14-2010, 03:23 PM
Debra A Debra A is offline
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Note the well inland placing. Maximum width 4.77 miles. Dave
Dave, what are the two inland finds marked on the left and right ( I suppose that should be East and West?) the map is a bit too small for me to make it out. Thanks
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Old 10-14-2010, 09:33 PM
protohistorian protohistorian is offline
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1889 map far right plot ( most east) is pinchin st. Far left (west) is an Elibeth Jackson limb found $ June," Early on Tuesday morning the 4th June 1889, reports began to be circulated about the gruesome discovery of human remains along two separate parts of the Thames. Three boys bathing near the Battersea park side of Albert Bridge had noticed a strange object being nudged by the tide against the muddy foreshore. On investigating the object, the boys were horrified to discover it was a human limb, wrapped in white cloth .The boys wrapped the limb up again and took it straight to the police. The local police immediately alerted Scotland Yard and the assistant divisional surgeon for Battersea, Dr. Kempster. The limb was examined by Dr Kempster who declared it to be a portion of a human thigh from hip to knee; his opinion was that the limb had not been in the water above 24 hours. The white cloth the limb was wrapped in was found to be a portion of an item of ladies underclothing, the waistband of which had the name L.E. Fisher written along it. Fastened to another portion of the material was a piece of tweed seemingly torn from the right breast area of a lady's long Ulster coat."
Quote is fromDebra A's paper and can be found in original context here.
http://www.casebook.org/victims/jackson.html

The well inland is the piece of Jackson in Battersea park, not w whole torso. Dave
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Last edited by protohistorian : 10-14-2010 at 09:37 PM.
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Old 10-14-2010, 09:47 PM
Debra A Debra A is offline
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1889 map far right plot ( most east) is pinchin st. Far left (west) is an Elibeth Jackson limb found $ June," Early on Tuesday morning the 4th June 1889, reports began to be circulated about the gruesome discovery of human remains along two separate parts of the Thames. Three boys bathing near the Battersea park side of Albert Bridge had noticed a strange object being nudged by the tide against the muddy foreshore. On investigating the object, the boys were horrified to discover it was a human limb, wrapped in white cloth .The boys wrapped the limb up again and took it straight to the police. The local police immediately alerted Scotland Yard and the assistant divisional surgeon for Battersea, Dr. Kempster. The limb was examined by Dr Kempster who declared it to be a portion of a human thigh from hip to knee; his opinion was that the limb had not been in the water above 24 hours. The white cloth the limb was wrapped in was found to be a portion of an item of ladies underclothing, the waistband of which had the name L.E. Fisher written along it. Fastened to another portion of the material was a piece of tweed seemingly torn from the right breast area of a lady's long Ulster coat."
Quote is fromDebra A's paper and can be found in original context here.
http://www.casebook.org/victims/jackson.html

The well inland is the piece of Jackson in Battersea park, not w whole torso. Dave
Cheers Dave,
It didn't click that you'd plotted Pinchin St and EJ together.
I did get my shredded wheat on the wrong side there didn't I?
Thanks
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Old 10-14-2010, 10:13 PM
protohistorian protohistorian is offline
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Default seperation and series

The tendenciy I am spotting is to seperate bits found alone with the Macnaghten series. Temporally, there is no speration, geographically, they are similar. Here is a plotting for an arm found outside a blind school 09/29/88. The press report is here.
http://www.casebook.org/press_report.../18880929.html
Dave
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Last edited by protohistorian : 10-14-2010 at 10:21 PM. Reason: photo
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  #17  
Old 10-15-2010, 06:17 AM
protohistorian protohistorian is offline
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Default help Debs?!?

Is the Chelsea home of Shelley the one at Churchill gardens? Who would have thought peotry paid so well, this cat has like 9 London houses. Dave
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Old 10-15-2010, 10:40 AM
Debra A Debra A is offline
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Is the Chelsea home of Shelley the one at Churchill gardens? Who would have thought peotry paid so well, this cat has like 9 London houses. Dave
Dave, off hand, I think the address was just Chelsea Embankment. ( #1 possibly) I will have to check later to be certain, I might be wrong.
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Old 10-15-2010, 01:05 PM
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Debs, your a rockstar! Image 1 is the postal directory listing for 1 chelsea embankment. Image 2 is a map showing the estate in relation to the rest of the Jackson finds. Dave
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Old 10-15-2010, 01:29 PM
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Default shelley and the park

Number 1 Chelsea Embankment in relation to Chelsea park. Dave
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