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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Suspects > Lechmere/Cross, Charles

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  #301  
Old 11-13-2018, 11:06 AM
jerryd jerryd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John G View Post
Why on earth would Lechmere be heading off to work in the early hours of the morning having committed a murder? And not only that, but via Mitre Square, hardly the most obvious route.
Speaking of the route, JG. I’m wondering how the road construction for the new tramway on Commercial Street would have altered pedestrian traffic? Apparently the construction lasted day and night.
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  #302  
Old 11-13-2018, 12:20 PM
Boggles Boggles is offline
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Just going back to the original post for a second, i just question whether we are making this more complicated than is necessary? Should we be looking at this as more of a box ticking exercise?

Question - is the suspect/candidate physically capable of being at the crime scenes for all of the 5 traditionally accepted murders?

If they were capable, then tick

But if they weren’t capable, then cross them off the list, we rule them out?

This being the case then certainly Lechmere merits further scrutiny as a potential suspect by those who choose to do so?

I did read several posts on this thread, but not all, so if someone else has already made this point, then i agree with them as well.
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  #303  
Old 11-13-2018, 12:40 PM
etenguy etenguy is offline
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Originally Posted by Boggles View Post
Just going back to the original post for a second, i just question whether we are making this more complicated than is necessary? Should we be looking at this as more of a box ticking exercise?

Question - is the suspect/candidate physically capable of being at the crime scenes for all of the 5 traditionally accepted murders?

If they were capable, then tick

But if they weren’t capable, then cross them off the list, we rule them out?

This being the case then certainly Lechmere merits further scrutiny as a potential suspect by those who choose to do so?

I did read several posts on this thread, but not all, so if someone else has already made this point, then i agree with them as well.
It is just that Lechmere is in a massive pool of people who are physically capable of being at all 5 canonical murder sites. Of itself, it is not a good reason for considering him a suspect.

That we believe he walked through the murder site area on his journey to work is interesting, though we have to speculate about his visiting family, and leaving that visit at a time which most might consider went way beyond out staying his welcome, to give him reason to be in the area for the double event.

Perhaps what really brings him into focus is being found in Bucks Row near a recently murdered victim. An accident of timing or reason to consider him the ripper? Clearly, the contemporary police eliminated him as a suspect, he did not behave in a way consistent with being the murderer, there is no evidence to support him being the murderer, and there is no sighting of him near other victims. His journey to work appears to be sufficiently compelling for some to consider him worthy of greater investigation. That's fine, but with all the research carried out, no evidence has been discovered, just potential opportunity.
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  #304  
Old 11-13-2018, 01:03 PM
Kattrup Kattrup is offline
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I think Ed Stow has claimed that Alfred Crow lived with his family in Ellen Court in 1881? He was approximately 13 at the time (Crow, that is).

So in his formative teenage years Alfred Crow lived a stone's throw from Pinchin Street.

No wonder he later returned and deposited a torso there.

Alfred Crow is geographically linked to the Pinchin Street torso murder AND the Tabram murder!
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  #305  
Old 11-13-2018, 01:21 PM
MrBarnett MrBarnett is offline
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Originally Posted by Kattrup View Post
I think Ed Stow has claimed that Alfred Crow lived with his family in Ellen Court in 1881? He was approximately 13 at the time (Crow, that is).

So in his formative teenage years Alfred Crow lived a stone's throw from Pinchin Street.

No wonder he later returned and deposited a torso there.

Alfred Crow is geographically linked to the Pinchin Street torso murder AND the Tabram murder!
As did I on another thread yesterday.

Ellen Court was even closer to Berner Street than it was to Pinchin Street.

Of course, when CAL lived in Pinchin Street, the immediate neighbourhood was 'Tiger Bay'. 20 years later, when Crow lived there, it was far less notorious.

Last edited by MrBarnett : 11-13-2018 at 01:23 PM.
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  #306  
Old 11-13-2018, 01:30 PM
Boggles Boggles is offline
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I agree with you, we are left with a great many suspects.

So with further box ticking can we not narrow down this down this pool until we are left with only a handful of credible suspects?
ie -
Did he approxmatly match the physial appearance of the most reliable witness statements? yes/no
Was he known to procure the services of prostitutes? yes/no
etc etc?

But to rule him out based on geography alone, as others have done is not logical in my opinion and i would seek to discourage it.
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  #307  
Old 11-13-2018, 02:12 PM
etenguy etenguy is offline
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Originally Posted by Boggles View Post
But to rule him out based on geography alone, as others have done is not logical in my opinion and i would seek to discourage it.
Indeed, the geography does not rule out Lechmere as a suspect. I think in this thread it is more about whether geography alone makes Lechmere a strong suspect. Or more specifically, whether Lechmere's speculated journeys and connections make him the strongest candidate, geographically speaking. Personally, I find the significance of geographical information concerning Lechmere is over-stated by those who champion Lechmere as a strong suspect.
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  #308  
Old 11-13-2018, 02:22 PM
MrBarnett MrBarnett is offline
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Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
Indeed, the geography does not rule out Lechmere as a suspect. I think in this thread it is more about whether geography alone makes Lechmere a strong suspect. Or more specifically, whether Lechmere's speculated journeys and connections make him the strongest candidate, geographically speaking. Personally, I find the significance of geographical information concerning Lechmere is over-stated by those who champion Lechmere as a strong suspect.
I believe this thread was started to counter suggestions that CAL was ruled out by some because he didn't live in a particular 'hot zone'.
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  #309  
Old 11-13-2018, 02:34 PM
etenguy etenguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBarnett View Post
I believe this thread was started to counter suggestions that CAL was ruled out by some because he didn't live in a particular 'hot zone'.
Sorry - I think I may have crossed threads with one where Fisherman challenges us to find a stronger suspect, geographically speaking, than Lechmere.
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  #310  
Old 11-13-2018, 02:37 PM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
Indeed, the geography does not rule out Lechmere as a suspect. I think in this thread it is more about whether geography alone makes Lechmere a strong suspect. Or more specifically, whether Lechmere's speculated journeys and connections make him the strongest candidate, geographically speaking. Personally, I find the significance of geographical information concerning Lechmere is over-stated by those who champion Lechmere as a strong suspect.
Hi Eten
what Gary just said one post up.


re geographics:
1 He was seen near a recently murdered victim (before trying to raise the alarm) in Bucks Row
2 His work route took him near the other murder sites at approx. TOD.
3 His mother lived (and he did earlier) near Berner street-which might explain earlier TODs of double event victims.
4 Goulston street is on a route back home from Mitre sq/Pickfords


add to that the discrepency with the name, and what was said to PC Mizen and I think we have a possible strong suspect (or as I prefer-least weak suspects).
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