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Non-Fiction: Jack and the Thames Torso Murders: A New Ripper? - by Abby Normal 12 minutes ago.
Mary Jane Kelly: Was Mary Kelly a Ripper victim? - by Trevor Marriott 14 minutes ago.
Motive, Method and Madness: Geoprofile of Jack the Ripper reveals Tabram and Nichols connection. - by MrBarnett 15 minutes ago.
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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Motive, Method and Madness

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  #141  
Old 10-21-2018, 02:14 PM
Batman Batman is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
She was considered a ripper victim by the police at the time of the murders. Her injuries were not the same as the mutilations and organ harvesting of later victims but her throat and lower abdomen were attacked.

Other reasons to consider her a JtR victim include:
* she fits the victim profile.
* her murder was in the same general time and area as the other victims.
* she was attacked with a knife (or knives).
* no evidence of rape or sexual assault.
* she was posed.

Against her being a JtR victim - the attack MO was different in part and less savage than other victims. In the context of escalating violence seen through the murder spree, this is perhaps a reason for including Tabram rather than discounting her as a JtR victim.
That's exactly right.
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  #142  
Old 10-21-2018, 02:46 PM
Varqm Varqm is offline
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He could have been a permanent local,but if a visitor,which I believe,he could have been related to Spitalfields market,although there are lots of possibilities.

In 1682, King Charles II granted John Balch the right to hold a market day on Thursdays and Saturdays in or near Spital Square but became customary to also held it in Tuesdays.Later on for those willing to pay toll,it's everyday except Sunday.

- there are three market days,there is a market everyday but the growers come on three days...on market days the market gardeners come.
- you can send in things at 3 am till 5 in the afternoon.
- Sellers paid 2 s per wagon 1s 6d per cart and some secure a place/stand always so consumer can remember the location.They pay by weight or stand or both.
- Farmer or market gardener pay 1l a week 52l a year for a space/stand,sometimes they could have be 20 horses in a day.
- Buyers,in summer,came at 3-4 am, costermongers 9 am.

This work tied him up to Spitalfields despite the increased press/patrols/vigilante.There were 6 policemen looking after the market,paid,not sure of their duties,,but it dwindled to 3.Tabram's murder was a Tuesday and a first week of the month,which could have been significant.

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Last edited by Varqm : 10-21-2018 at 02:49 PM.
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  #143  
Old 10-21-2018, 04:29 PM
etenguy etenguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Varqm View Post
He could have been a permanent local,but if a visitor,which I believe,he could have been related to Spitalfields market,although there are lots of possibilities.
As strong a possibility as others that have been suggested.
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  #144  
Old 10-21-2018, 04:53 PM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
She was considered a ripper victim by the police at the time of the murders. Her injuries were not the same as the mutilations and organ harvesting of later victims but her throat and lower abdomen were attacked.

Other reasons to consider her a JtR victim include:
* she fits the victim profile.
* her murder was in the same general time and area as the other victims.
* she was attacked with a knife (or knives).
* no evidence of rape or sexual assault.
* she was posed.

Against her being a JtR victim - the attack MO was different in part and less savage than other victims. In the context of escalating violence seen through the murder spree, this is perhaps a reason for including Tabram rather than discounting her as a JtR victim.
Bingo. And she was found with her skirt raised up.
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  #145  
Old 10-21-2018, 11:11 PM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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A prostitute with her skirt up? Whatever next?
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  #146  
Old 10-21-2018, 11:18 PM
DJA DJA is offline
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Coincidence
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  #147  
Old 10-21-2018, 11:25 PM
Fisherman Fisherman is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
She was considered a ripper victim by the police at the time of the murders. Her injuries were not the same as the mutilations and organ harvesting of later victims but her throat and lower abdomen were attacked.

Other reasons to consider her a JtR victim include:
* she fits the victim profile.
* her murder was in the same general time and area as the other victims.
* she was attacked with a knife (or knives).
* no evidence of rape or sexual assault.
* she was posed.

Against her being a JtR victim - the attack MO was different in part and less savage than other victims. In the context of escalating violence seen through the murder spree, this is perhaps a reason for including Tabram rather than discounting her as a JtR victim.
Personally, I think the strongest pointer in favour of a shared culprit may be the fact that both had knife wounds on their private parts.
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  #148  
Old 10-21-2018, 11:48 PM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fisherman View Post
Personally, I think the strongest pointer in favour of a shared culprit may be the fact that both had knife wounds on their private parts.
Very much in the minority (understatement) in Tabram's case, as stabs were very much in the minority, if not absent, in Nichols'.
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  #149  
Old 10-22-2018, 12:02 AM
John G John G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etenguy View Post
She was considered a ripper victim by the police at the time of the murders. Her injuries were not the same as the mutilations and organ harvesting of later victims but her throat and lower abdomen were attacked.

Other reasons to consider her a JtR victim include:
* she fits the victim profile.
* her murder was in the same general time and area as the other victims.
* she was attacked with a knife (or knives).
* no evidence of rape or sexual assault.
* she was posed.

Against her being a JtR victim - the attack MO was different in part and less savage than other victims. In the context of escalating violence seen through the murder spree, this is perhaps a reason for including Tabram rather than discounting her as a JtR victim.
I think this is a fair assessment, although Canter pointed out that around 75% of serial sexual murder victims are posed and overkill occurs in 70% of cases.

Regarding whether the murder was less savage. Tabram waa subjected to what appeared to be a frenzied, and possibly prolonged, knife attack. Contrastingly, the other victims may have been taken by surprise and killed quickly, with the abdominal injuries inflicted post mortem.

Last edited by John G : 10-22-2018 at 12:21 AM.
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  #150  
Old 10-22-2018, 12:15 AM
Fisherman Fisherman is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
Very much in the minority (understatement) in Tabram's case, as stabs were very much in the minority, if not absent, in Nichols'.
I am not comparing cuts to stabs here, Gareth - I am saying that in both cases, the killer targetted the private parts and attacked them with his knife. That looks much like a signature element to me.

Last edited by Fisherman : 10-22-2018 at 12:25 AM.
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