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  #5051  
Old 09-26-2018, 06:39 AM
NickB NickB is offline
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So Woffinden has inserted the Rhyl alibi into the middle of the previously described Liverpool alibi and completely ignored the contradictions this produces.
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  #5052  
Old 09-27-2018, 12:24 PM
Graham Graham is offline
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Thanks are due, from myself at any rate, to Nick and Spitfire for clearing up many, if not all, of the areas of confusion concerning Woffo's take on the Liverpool/Rhyl alibis. I always had the feeling that Woffo, if not quite making it up as he went along, was relying to an extent upon the credulity of his readers, but was never quite able to put my finger on it. He was certainly not doing his case many favours.

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  #5053  
Old 09-27-2018, 10:07 PM
Alfie Alfie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham View Post
Thanks are due, from myself at any rate, to Nick and Spitfire for clearing up many, if not all, of the areas of confusion concerning Woffo's take on the Liverpool/Rhyl alibis. I always had the feeling that Woffo, if not quite making it up as he went along, was relying to an extent upon the credulity of his readers, but was never quite able to put my finger on it. He was certainly not doing his case many favours.

Graham
Seconded.
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  #5054  
Old 09-28-2018, 01:33 AM
NickB NickB is offline
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The way he could have walked from Maidenhead railway station along the Thames Path to the cornfield is shown on the first map on this pdf ...

https://www.visitthames.co.uk/dbimgs...sor%20Walk.pdf
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  #5055  
Old 09-28-2018, 04:12 AM
Derrick Derrick is offline
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Quote:
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The way he could have walked from Maidenhead railway station along the Thames Path to the cornfield is shown on the first map on this pdf ...

https://www.visitthames.co.uk/dbimgs...sor%20Walk.pdf

...and seen doing so by whom in particular?
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  #5056  
Old 09-30-2018, 02:10 PM
Graham Graham is offline
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...and seen doing so by whom in particular?
....so could you perhaps please tell us who saw him on the bus from Liverpool to Rhyl on 21 August, and back again on the 24th? Anyone in particular?

Graham
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  #5057  
Old 09-30-2018, 04:21 PM
cobalt cobalt is offline
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Come on Graham,

You know you can do better than that. An amateurish effort, from your good self. Hanratty was under no obligation to prove beyond doubt his alibi as the trial judge very properly made clear. He cannot, even in hindsight, be judged to the same tolerance as the prosecution, which is what you are seeking to do. There is no equivalence between the need to prove innocence or guilt as you well know.

The fact is that around a dozen people in Liverpool and Rhyl believe they saw Hanratty around the time of the crime. Some of these witnesses are less than reliable and others may be confused about dates and faces. But in terms of ‘reasonable doubt’ the A6 Case is a no contest. For, in way of contrast, no one saw Hanratty approach the scene of the crime. Not one. Not a passing motorist. Not a fellow walker on the tow path. Not even a sharp eyed ticket collector at Taplow Station? No, no one. Not even Mrs. Lanz at the Taplow Inn. And, Lord knows, I am sure the police were trying their best. They drew an utter blank.

Nor did any reliable witness see him leave the scene of the crime or deposit the car. Not a motorist aware of his crap driving or a frustrated resident. Nothing of substance, unless you buy into the dubious and contradictory evidence of some early morning workers, worth less than the chap in Derbyshire who at least spotted a green pom-pom hat. And the murder/rape car produced, in terms of forensic evidence…nothing! That’s right…nothing! Can anyone of our generation really believe this? Understandably, younger readers assume DNA and CSI began in their lifetimes, but those of us of a certain age know better. There were forensic convictions dating back to the 1930s although many here would rather you did not know that. Fibres and hair samples were, even in the 1960s, at a level considered more than adequate even today. Consider that for moment, given the sexual assault: no hair or fibre evidence. Or perhaps more accurately, no fibre or hair evidence relevant to the conviction of James Hanratty.

Hanratty did not have to produce one witness from Liverpool/Rhyl, although he did. The prosecution DID have to produce a witness and they managed to do so in the form of Valerie Storie. She alone and clearly the most vital witness. The problem with her evidence, well documented here. is the main reason we are all still here. Hanratty, whether innocent or guilty -and I strongly suspect the former- should have walked.
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  #5058  
Old 10-01-2018, 01:45 AM
Spitfire Spitfire is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickB View Post
The way he could have walked from Maidenhead railway station along the Thames Path to the cornfield is shown on the first map on this pdf ...

https://www.visitthames.co.uk/dbimgs...sor%20Walk.pdf
No one reported having seen a smartly suited twenty-something years old walking along the towpath which means either that route was not taken by Hanratty or, if taken, then he was not noticed by anyone.
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  #5059  
Old 10-01-2018, 02:46 AM
Graham Graham is offline
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1] The inference seems to be that, as no-one actually saw Hanratty during his journey to the cornfield, he was never there.

2] On the other hand, he claimed to have travelled by bus from Liverpool to Rhyl and back again, yet as far as I'm aware nobody claimed to have seen him on either bus or at the respective bus stations. Therefore I think I am justified in applying similar logic per [1] above and say that he never made either journey at the critical time of the A6 Crime. Which he didn't.

FWIW, I've always felt that he arrived at the cornfield by walking down Marsh Lane, possibly from Taplow station, or a bus-stop, which would account for his immaculate appearance, according to Valerie's description. And of course it was dark, or nearly dark, when he tapped on the car's window.

Graham
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  #5060  
Old 10-01-2018, 03:27 AM
Spitfire Spitfire is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham View Post
1] The inference seems to be that, as no-one actually saw Hanratty during his journey to the cornfield, he was never there.
I think it is only "moste" with his plastic suit theory who contends that the abduction did not take place at the cornfield in Dorney Reach. Therefore the gunman (to use a neutral term) must have got there by one means or another.
Quote:
On the other hand, he claimed to have travelled by bus from Liverpool to Rhyl and back again, yet as far as I'm aware nobody claimed to have seen him on either bus or at the respective bus stations. Therefore I think I am justified in applying similar logic per [1] above and say that he never made either journey at the critical time of the A6 Crime. Which he didn't.
It would be asking a lot of the passengers and conductors on the Liverpool - Rhyl bus to recall in February the identity of one fellow traveller over five months after the journey in question. Whereas, given the publicity which the crime generated, one would have expected anyone sighting a smartly suited twenty-something year old walking along to towpath in the early evening of 22 August to have gone to the police in the days immediately following the murder.

Quote:
FWIW, I've always felt that he arrived at the cornfield by walking down Marsh Lane, possibly from Taplow station, or a bus-stop, which would account for his immaculate appearance, according to Valerie's description. And of course it was dark, or nearly dark, when he tapped on the car's window.
But why go tooled up for an armed robbery starting out from Taplow Station and ending up in a cornfield?

My own opinion is that Hanratty had joined forces with an accomplice or accomplices one of whom had a get away car. For one reason or another the target of the armed raid was abandoned and it was decided to burgle one of the opulent drums (and basses) on Harcourt Road. Before the burglary could be completed Hanratty's chum or chums scarper taking the getaway car with them.

Hanratty, carrying a gun and ammunition, is now alone. His solution is to hijack Gregsten's car but this presented other problems which Jim never properly resolved.
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