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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Mary Jane Kelly

View Poll Results: Was Mary Kelly a Ripper victim?
Yes 59 83.10%
No 8 11.27%
Undecided 4 5.63%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

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  #481  
Old 09-20-2018, 09:59 AM
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caz caz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl View Post
With the Ripper murders, you have the ages at 43, 47, 45, 43... and 25. And granted, Nichols was said to look about ten years younger than she was, but even so she'd be a mature adult at the most generous. If Kelly look about ten years older then that would at least be something, but her description as beautiful suggests otherwise.
Goodness, don't let Helen Mirren or Joanna Lumley see this!

And what is your evidence for MJK being 25, apart from what she may have claimed herself?

Quote:
And beauty, with respects to the first four, could hardly be said to be a quality they shared with Kelly.
Oh blimey! Their killer operated at dead of night - he wasn't recruiting for Miss World with a black bag full of skimpy swimsuits.

Have you lost the plot, Karl?

Love,

Caz
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Last edited by caz : 09-20-2018 at 10:05 AM.
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  #482  
Old 09-20-2018, 10:00 AM
Michael W Richards Michael W Richards is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caz View Post

I strongly disagree - both with the value of trying to 'categorise' MJK in the first place, and with her being a square peg in a round hole. You'd need evidence that she was not precisely the ripper's cup of tea - being a vulnerable female, living on her wits, who had nobody with her to keep her safe when her killer encountered her.
You must have meant more evidence Caz, because the square peg and round hole analogy is certainly apt based on what we know:

-indoor kill-1st and only
-no evidence victim met killer soliciting
-no focus on female abdomen
-known to be in love triangle at the time.
-15 years or more younger than preceding victims
-had flesh cut from thighs to the bone
-left uterus behind
-did not leave body in public view, actually prevented any easy access to it.

The plethora of things that were unique in the Kelly murder have often been explained by arguments such as "well, he finally had a private venue"..."or he lost his mind committing this murder"...neither of which are anything substantiated by any real evidence. Who says outdoors weren't his objective? Who says he changed from stranger to stranger encounters with actively working prostitutes to intimate killing in the victims own private room?

All of the malarkey that attempts to connect Mary...and also Liz...with the women who were killed by someone who posed as a client and then attacked them outdoors amounts to a pile of speculation that is used to create a Canonical Group.

The women who we don't know were soliciting at the time of their murders had dumped lovers that same week or shown less than alledged commitment to their partners. That in and of itself leave room for motives that do not include drooling madmen.
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  #483  
Old 09-20-2018, 10:24 AM
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caz caz is offline
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Michael,

We are never going to see eye to eye on this, and I have no intention of dipping my pretty [as in pretty unsightly] toes into the realms of fantasy, so I'll just say this:

The more arguments [half reasonable, questionable or downright loopy] I see listed for MJK being a square peg in a round hole, the less credible I find the argument for another killer hoping to pull off the perfect copycat ripper murder!

Your man was clueless, wasn't he? Indoors when all the others had been out? What was his problem? Did MJK never venture out alone at night?

Left the uterus behind, when he had gone to all the time and trouble to remove it, along with the kidneys, for display purposes only? What was his problem? Pockets not deep enough? Didn't have the prescribed black bag with him?

I could go on, but I'm sure everyone would prefer that I don't.

See you all when I return from Portmeirion - if they let me return.

Love,

Caz
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Last edited by caz : 09-20-2018 at 10:27 AM.
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  #484  
Old 09-20-2018, 03:03 PM
AuroraSarintacos AuroraSarintacos is offline
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I agree with everything Caz has said previously. Summed up my opinion on the matter perfectly.
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