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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Non-Canonical Victims > Torso Killings

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  #771  
Old 08-17-2018, 06:55 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Flynn View Post
I'm OK with excluding Stride, but not Eddowes. McKenzie neither had a uterus, kidney nor any other lower abdominal organ removed, mainly because her abdomen wasn't cut through. Indeed, her only abdominal cut extended from the bottom of her breast to her navel, i.e. on the upper abdomen, and it was not deep, either.

Stride, of course, sustained no abdominal wounds at all, only a cut throat - and that not as severe as we've seen in other Ripper victims. In my view, both she and McKenzie were killed by two different men, and neither of them was the Ripper. Or Torsoman, for that matter.
oh shoot Sam-I meant to say stride or Nichols!!!! sorry!
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  #772  
Old 08-18-2018, 12:37 AM
FrankO FrankO is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
Let me give you an example. When i was young and more stupid and reckless i liked to do coke. Most of the time i liked to do it in the comfort of my home, having purchased from friends, and would indulge at leisure. Howeber, there was a period when the habit was at its worst, where if i ran out, i would go out and buy it from “dealers” out on the street or pushers at some coke house and do some there. This was more impulsive, less plannning, riskier, and even the way i took it was different.

Hopefully you can see the analogy.
I can see the analogy, Abby, but it only goes so far. What the Ripper did to his victims took longer than doing coke (correct me if I’m wrong); what he did was more conspicuous & looked more suspicious than doing coke and, last but not least, getting caught cutting up a woman would mean he would hang, whereas getting caught doing coke wouldn’t.
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Where as i agree there is probably more planning that needs to be involved in the torso murders its not that much of a distinction really to be significant.
That’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it, but it far from convinces me.

Cheers
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  #773  
Old 08-18-2018, 01:21 AM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
If mckenzie isnt a ripper victim than neither is stride and eddowes
Stride may not have been a Ripper victim. The big problem with McKenzie is why the comparatively large gap?
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  #774  
Old 08-18-2018, 06:45 AM
John G John G is offline
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Stride may not have been a Ripper victim. The big problem with McKenzie is why the comparatively large gap?
There are other problems with McKenzie as well, John, such as the absence of the "Ripper's" signature neck mutilations, and extensive abdominal mutilations and organ removal.
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  #775  
Old 08-18-2018, 10:35 AM
John Wheat John Wheat is offline
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There are other problems with McKenzie as well, John, such as the absence of the "Ripper's" signature neck mutilations, and extensive abdominal mutilations and organ removal.
I'm aware of the other problems with McKenzie John. To be honest considering the gap if McKenzie was a Ripper victim than surely a killer like the Ripper would have really gone to town you'd expect the mutilations to be similar to those inflicted on Mary Jane Kelly.
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  #776  
Old 08-18-2018, 11:46 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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I can see the analogy, Abby, but it only goes so far. What the Ripper did to his victims took longer than doing coke (correct me if I’m wrong); what he did was more conspicuous & looked more suspicious than doing coke and, last but not least, getting caught cutting up a woman would mean he would hang, whereas getting caught doing coke wouldn’t.
That’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it, but it far from convinces me.

Cheers
Frank im not making a direct comparison. Its an analogy so again the detailed point by point you made is misguided.

Im trying to say that the urge is there, perhaps thrill factor too, and if the usual MO is not available (say perhaps because no access to chop shop, or maybe he was having problems getting women to it for some reason) then MO may change.

Urge is strong. Different circs. Differnt MO.
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"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #777  
Old 08-20-2018, 07:19 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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would anyone like to remark on and explain why both the ripper and torso series ended at about the same time? One that went on for years and another, if you include Mckenzie, and I do, about a year?

have yet to see anyone really take this one on.
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"Is all that we see or seem
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"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #778  
Old 08-20-2018, 07:21 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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I'm aware of the other problems with McKenzie John. To be honest considering the gap if McKenzie was a Ripper victim than surely a killer like the Ripper would have really gone to town you'd expect the mutilations to be similar to those inflicted on Mary Jane Kelly.
not if he was interrupted as he was with Stride and Nichols.
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"Is all that we see or seem
but a dream within a dream?"

-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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  #779  
Old 08-20-2018, 07:49 AM
Sam Flynn Sam Flynn is offline
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Originally Posted by Abby Normal View Post
not if he was interrupted as he was with Stride and Nichols.
Was he interrupted during the two stabs to the left side of her neck, the (not unduly deep) cut from the breast to the navel, the scratches on her belly, or the single small cut to her pubic area?
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  #780  
Old 08-20-2018, 08:15 AM
Abby Normal Abby Normal is offline
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Was he interrupted during the two stabs to the left side of her neck, the (not unduly deep) cut from the breast to the navel, the scratches on her belly, or the single small cut to her pubic area?
if he was, then probably right after or during the last thing he did obviously.
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"Is all that we see or seem
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-Edgar Allan Poe


"...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

-Frederick G. Abberline
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