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Go Back   Casebook Forums > Ripper Discussions > Victims > Mary Jane Kelly

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  #61  
Old 02-19-2018, 11:36 PM
DJA DJA is offline
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Reckon there are a number of "typos".
First move 13 up on the map so it's entrance door is no longer under the passage.
Move the GF hole in the wall to the left,so that it is in alignment with 13's "partition door" and the Dorset Street door. (The one foot on that gap confuses a bit).
I have no problem with "Prater's door" being halfway along the passage,but don't tell Wicky D'oh!

Reckon all rooms were identical 10' x 12'. Might have been a main staircase from the door halfway up the passage ie what now appears to be "Prater's door".

Phew. Easier working out who JtR was.
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Last edited by DJA : 02-19-2018 at 11:41 PM.
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  #62  
Old 02-20-2018, 03:06 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
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Dave.

This 3D model was the last version from Richard that I know of.
Richard, myself, and a number of other members provided input. I think it is pretty close to reality.



Quote:
Originally Posted by DJA View Post
Reckon there are a number of "typos".
First move 13 up on the map so it's entrance door is no longer under the passage.
Move the GF hole in the wall to the left,so that it is in alignment with 13's "partition door" and the Dorset Street door. (The one foot on that gap confuses a bit).
I have no problem with "Prater's door" being halfway along the passage,but don't tell Wicky D'oh!

Reckon all rooms were identical 10' x 12'. Might have been a main staircase from the door halfway up the passage ie what now appears to be "Prater's door".

Phew. Easier working out who JtR was.
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  #63  
Old 02-20-2018, 03:16 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
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Originally Posted by jerryd View Post
Wick,

During the Kate Marshall murder case the floor above ground level is referred to as the first floor at #26 Dorset Street and indicated by the fact Davis Roberts said he went to the landing. No?
Hi Jerry.

In the 3D model above, we included the details from the Kate Marshall case.
However, if you are commenting on the Ground/First floor issue, I'm not sure the point you are making.
Roberts occupied the room above Kelly's, her's being on the ground floor, him being up on the First floor.
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  #64  
Old 02-20-2018, 04:41 PM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
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Originally Posted by Wickerman View Post
Hi Jerry.

In the 3D model above, we included the details from the Kate Marshall case.
Hi Jon.
Didn't the case show that Mrs Roberts ran out of no.19, past her husband and sister as they struggled on the landing, collapsing at or just past Amory's (and Mrs Prater's) door and also at the top of the "down" stairs? If so, doesn't the model have the stairs going the wrong way?
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  #65  
Old 02-20-2018, 06:20 PM
Wickerman Wickerman is offline
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Hi Joshua.
If I recall....both Mrs Roberts & Kate Marshall fell at the top of the stairs.
Didn't Mrs Roberts fall against her husband, while it was Kate Marshall who fell on the landing?
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  #66  
Old 02-20-2018, 11:32 PM
DJA DJA is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickerman View Post
Dave.

This 3D model was the last version from Richard that I know of.
Richard, myself, and a number of other members provided input. I think it is pretty close to reality.

Reckon that is a marvelous interpretation and may well be very close.

We know from photos that 13 was completely outside of the passage.
Wonder if the passage gap/door is another door to the stairs part way across the building.

For a luxury townhouse,that is a very inefficient waste of space.
Probably born out by the chimneys,which are likely to be one a room or possibly two if there is a double room.


Reckon there was a side hallway,as you know.
Suspect the back stairs ran partway across the building,not along it.

Keep up the Good Work!
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Last edited by DJA : 02-20-2018 at 11:39 PM. Reason: Typo
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  #67  
Old 02-21-2018, 02:54 AM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickerman View Post
Hi Joshua.
If I recall....both Mrs Roberts & Kate Marshall fell at the top of the stairs.
Didn't Mrs Roberts fall against her husband, while it was Kate Marshall who fell on the landing?
Yes, Mrs Roberts pushed past them as they struggled (Marshall on the floor) against Amory's partition, getting blood on his shirt. Then she collapsed at the top of the stairs at Amory's door. At least, that's how I read it.

Roberts: "she came out and fell against me in the passage—she squeezed through us—I let her go by to get assistance, and when she got to the top of the staircase she fell"

Amory: "I saw the deceased coming out of her own door when I opened my door—I could see her door from where I was standing—Roberts and the prisoner were struggling on the right-hand side of my door, in the corner—the prisoner was sitting down on the floor, and Roberts held her two wrists—Mrs. Roberts fell at my door."

To me, this shows that Amory's door was on the landing at the top of the stairs, and so would have been passed by anyone going to or from room 19.
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  #68  
Old 02-21-2018, 04:28 AM
Joshua Rogan Joshua Rogan is online now
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Originally Posted by DJA View Post
For a luxury townhouse,that is a very inefficient waste of space.
Since all mentions of internal walls seem to say they were just wooden partitions (one mention in the Marshall trial of wainscotting), does this indicate that the entire original building was gutted when it was divided into flats by Miller?
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  #69  
Old 02-21-2018, 05:07 AM
DJA DJA is offline
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panelling

One person's wainscoting is another's wooden partitions.

It would be interesting to find any Census records for 1851/61/71.
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Last edited by DJA : 02-21-2018 at 05:09 AM. Reason: Spelling.
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  #70  
Old 02-21-2018, 05:43 AM
richardh richardh is offline
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Question:
Is 8'6" a bit too high for the ceilings? because at the moment that's what I have used for my current model. It seems really high!
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