Kosminski and Victim DNA Match on Shawl

[Trevor Marriott]

Hi Trevor,

Is an M-Vac the same as a J. Edgar Hoover?

Regards,

Simon

Also related to J.Arthur Rank !

[TizerisT]

Who in turn is related to J.R. Hartley

[Phil Carter]

Who in turn is related to J.R. Hartley

Who is a jammy fellow indeed. :-)

[TizerisT]

Sorry Phil, did you miss post 1260? I would like to hear your thoughts on that if possible.

[robhouse]

A few snippets of online discussion of T1a1 Jews.

"Now back to mtDNA - T1 has a very different distribution than mtDNA T2, the latter in my experience is often found in Central Europeans. mtDNA T1a1 and its subgroup mtDNA T1a1a1 is very widely distributed, from Tocharian Mummies in the Tarim Basin of today's China, to Central Russia, Scandinavia, Pakistan, Middle East, North Africa, East and West Europe and among Ashkenazi Jews. Local hotspots are in Romania, Coastal Morocco, places in Central Russia. There is fantastic paper by Mala, that describes all this and more."

-- http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.co...-03/1363808606


"I have basic 'clan mother' T1a1 with about 40 FGS matches. My ancestry is Jewish from Western Ukraine. Below is the pedigree..."

http://www.worldfamilies.net/forum/index.php?topic=3629.new

[pinkmoon]

My idea to resolve this won't cost us a penny.

[Phil Carter]

Phil, do you not think that it may have been further away from the body? As I alluded to in the other post, the killer may have thrown it somewhere feet, maybe yards from the body. As a result = not admissable in any way, even if blood spatters were even noticed, which they may not have been. Poor lighting and all that?

Hello TizerisT,

If you are starting to use this length of conjecture... the police would have been searching all over that square for clues. There isn't a cat's hope in hell's chance that HAD the 8ft x 2ft piece of material been found elsewhere thrown, as you say somewhere.....(which it MUST have been for Edward's claims for Amos asking for it on the way to the mortuary to be true).. nobody would have noted it somewhere in a notebook.. including the policeman that saw it, picked it up, referred to his superior "'ere sarg...look what Ive found 'ere then..." then Inspector Collard etc etc etc.. (The place was swarming with policemen whilst the body was being examined)

Poor lighting? Not a chance... because the doctors needed light to examine the corpse and with ample policemen around, lanterns a plenty, especially when combing the square for more clues..

best regards

Phil

[Fisherman]

There ARE ashkenazi jews in the maternal T group, Rob - but not to a very significant extent. Less than 5 per cent of them are T grouped. And when we go to the subclades the numbers will lower again.

But they are there! However, the T1a1 maternal DNA group is not one where the ashkenazis are very prevalent as Louhelainen states.

the best,
Fisherman

[auspirograph]

Gulling

Nah,

The UK Ripperologists just aint as gullible as the Aussie ones.

Monty

It's quite simple really, no shawl was noted on the police list of Eddowes's effects and, no substantial evidence exists to place any suspect on the murder scene let alone Kosminski.

Pure cricket, that's why the ashes generally stay with us

[Poch]

It's quite simple really, no shawl was noted on the police list of Eddowes's effects and, no substantial evidence exists to place any suspect on the murder scene let alone Kosminski.

Pure cricket, that's why the ashes generally stay with us

It's explained in the authors theory why its not on the police list, so it's not that simple when discussing it in this context. I've posted it at least twice in this thread I think, for people who keep bringing this up.

I'll keep quiet about the cricket though, we're going to get slayed in the next ashes

[Prosector]

You resort to namecalling, and I'm the pompous one. Loads of logic in that statement.

And whether you read it or not, I corrected my mistake about the location of graffiti.

I don't need anyone to explain police jurisdiction to me. I work for State Police. The specific area I cover is on a jurisdiction line with City police on one side, County police on the other. Two days ago, we had a shooting on the County side. Within 3 minutes of the shooting, cops from all 3 jurisdictions (city, county, and state) were on scene. How could this be? You and others act as though there is the magical jurisdictional force field that keeps officers from entering into another jurisdiction.

There were murders in two jurisdictions, less than a mile apart on the same night. Evidence from a crime in one jurisdiction was then left in the other jurisdiction. So, to me, it is utterly ridiculous to assume that many officers from both jurisdictions didn't cross paths that night.

I have read several of your books and agree that you are a foremost expert on the JtR subject. However, your expertise and knowledge is based on the KNOWN FACTS of the case. Which officers came into contact with other officers, except where specifically recorded, are NOT KNOWN FACTS. So to say that you are more knowledgeable than me on which officers saw/contacted each other that night is rubbish. That's like saying you're more knowledgeable on what the officer ate for supper that night.

And for the umpteenth time, I agree that this shawl story sounds like it is 'probably' a fantasy/hoax. But no true scholar who is interested in finding the truth would dismiss it outright without further research. And THAT is the problem I have with many of the posters on this thread.

I don't think anyone disagrees that police from both sides (City and H Division) crossed the City boundary that night. In fact it is quite clear that they did since a City detective, DC Halse, took a copy of the Goulston Street graffito. What is much less likely is that a policeman from N Division (Islington) which is at least two miles away and well outside the area of the City should have been there (unless he had specifically been drafted in).
Prosector

[Outlaw]

This sums things up nicely..

https://theconversation.com/new-evidence-points-to-old-jack-the-ripper-suspect-but-here-is-why-im-not-convinced-31445

[Pontius2000]

Hi
An interesting post. However we shouldn't forget that Simpson was a Met officer, and we know that the Met had a murder in their district not one hour before the murder of Eddowes in another district close by.

So is it wrong to assume that the Met officers would have been otherwise engaged in assisting with the met murder rather than be wandering around another police district without any purpose ?

I'm not saying they were "assisting" each other. I'm saying they would have crossed paths, been in contact with each other, etc. they wouldn't have necessarily been working on each other's cases, but they WOULD have been working toward the same end....looking for the same person. So they would not have been totally independent of each other either.

Murder A happens in the Met.
Murder B happens in the City.
Evidence from Murder B is taken into the jurisdiction of Murder A's location
Cops from both locations are running around looking for the same man.

The above is why I say there WOULD have been cops outside of their own jurisdiction chasing leads. That's why I say it's wrong to dismiss outright that Simpson COULD have been out of his jurisdiction because of this imaginary jurisdiction force field that people don't fully understand.

[pinkmoon]

I'm not saying they were "assisting" each other. I'm saying they would have crossed paths, been in contact with each other, etc. they wouldn't have necessarily been working on each other's cases, but they WOULD have been working toward the same end....looking for the same person. So they would not have been totally independent of each other either.

Murder A happens in the Met.
Murder B happens in the City.
Evidence from Murder B is taken into the jurisdiction of Murder A's location
Cops from both locations are running around looking for the same man.

The above is why I say there WOULD have been cops outside of their own jurisdiction chasing leads. That's why I say it's wrong to dismiss outright that Simpson COULD have been out of his jurisdiction because of this imaginary jurisdiction force field that people don't fully understand.

There is also another theory which is gaining momentum as we speak .

[Monty]

It's explained in the authors theory why its not on the police list, so it's not that simple when discussing it in this context. I've posted it at least twice in this thread I think, for people who keep bringing this up.

I'll keep quiet about the cricket though, we're going to get slayed in the next ashes

I think we are aware of it, just not buying it.

The items were listed as they were removed at mortuary.

I disagree about the Ashes, Aussies don't do green tops.

Monty