Bradford serial killer

[Andrew Firth]

Very interesting pictures Silverstealth.

I've just passed over Baildon Bridge which crosses the River Aire in Shipley, and they've erected some metal fencing to stop anyone overlooking the area where the body was found.

I'm planning on visiting the Saltaire Brewery later today for their monthly "beer club", and from your photos it looks like me and my mates will have problems getting there, as we usually pass along the canal towpath en route.

All the best
Andrew

[Ally]

If any Steves go missing from the boards, then it's time to be creeped out. However I sincerely doubt the majority of conversation on these boards, which tends to the "what was the precise distance from where A was to where B was" is going to provide much food. There are a lot more gore and slash websites out there.

[Limehouse]

Interesting pictures.

According to today's Daily Telegraph, the caretaker of the buildings in which the arrested man lived was reviewing the weekend's CCTV footage of inside the building to check for any unauthorised persons or acts of vandalism. This is something he did regularly. He actually saw the accused man chase a woman down a corridor, knock her out, retreat into his flat and return with a crossbow, and fire a shot into her head. He then dragged her back into his flat. That is pretty convincing evidence of one of the murders.

A neighbour stated that he had been told by the man himself he was studying for a Phd in Jack the Ripper.

It gives me the creeps to think he might have broused these boards, perhaps even joined and posted. It has made me think hard. I assume that most people are here because they have an interest in the social and historical aspects of various crimes, but mainly JtR. However, am I unwittingly feeding the unhealthy obsession of a sick individual?

[silverstealth]

The Canal, Dockfield Road, Shipley.

[silverstealth]

[silverstealth]

The image above shows the Longlands area, back in 1888, and before it was the Bradford equivalent of Whitechapel.

The photos below were taken at Tetley St just off Thornton road

[tnb]

Merely defending your honour, old boy!

Am in the middle of asking a question on the photographs and drawings threads to which I am sure you could offer a reply, by the way.

[Andrew Firth]

Did someone say something? My ears are burning for some reason....

Andrew

[tnb]

It's to be hoped that having an interest in serial killers and spending an unhealthy amount of time discussing them on the Internet is not enough!

Here, here Chris! I made exactly that point on Facebook last night to our very own Shipley resident, Mr. Andrew Firth!

[Chris]

... Nugnug is right - sometimes just being 'weird' is not enough ...

It's to be hoped that having an interest in serial killers and spending an unhealthy amount of time discussing them on the Internet is not enough!

[tnb]

Rigby - That's a bit of a confused analogy to be fair, as the failing in the case of Stagg was not that the police didn't get enough evidence to convict him but rather that they should never have tried to concoct a case against him in the first place. But I take your point. We are not judge and jury, however, and Nugnug is right - sometimes just being 'weird' is not enough, and let's hope if this man is guilty that they have remembered that solid evidence is needed. To be fair, this does appear a little more clearcut! Appearances ain't everything though...I think it's fair to say we would expect a PHD criminology student to plan a murder spree a little more efficiently. Unless being discovered was the whole point, that is...

Nugnug - I am sure your intentions are admirable, and as I have said above I agree with the sentiment. But as Rigby says when is the right time? Let's face it, we discuss, to a greater or lesser extent, people's innocence or guilt on largely unfounded allegations every single day on here and on the basis of evidence a great deal more circumstancial than appears to be the case here. Is this any more or less morally questionable because of the distance of years? Look at the newspapers - It is human nature to speculate, I am afraid. I think you will find that most people on here, or interested in true crime in general, will discuss the case much more objectively and sympathetically than much of the national press.

[Rigby]

isn't it just a bit early to be speculating on his guilt or innocence

When is the right time then ? He's arrested and being questioned on suspicion of some sort of involvement and there is - so we hear - CCTV footage of someone killing a woman (in his road ?) with a crossbow. Fella owns a crossbow, is into 'dark' things inc. 'Ripper' crimes against women - so we hear. I hope the Police have learned from Colin Stagg's saga and have enough evidential suspicion to be onto a winner here and get this guy off our streets for ever.

[nugnug]

isn't it just a bit early to be speculating on his guilt or innocence

[tnb]

Rigby - it could well be that the police passed on certain instructions to the press learned from the Ipswich case, but I would say it is more likely in the most part that the sad and simple truth is that missing prostitutes are not national news. Only when they turned up dead did these women become any different (in a news sense) to probably hundreds of other sex workers all over the country who have run away or for other reasons have not been seen by anyone (or at least anyone who would be likely to give a statement to the police) for a week or two or three. If and when their bodies are discovered, of course, as in 1888, the newspapers who would not have found a column inch for them alive go into a kind of hyperbolic frenzy in order to say how tragic their lives were. Or am I just getting cynical?

I don't think there was ever any hope that the 'Ripper' tag would be ignored, regrettable as it is for the reasons you suggest. It does illustrate the intriguing way in which the 'name' has passed into folklore and along the way shed many of its original associations - in this case, as in Ipswich, the phrase seems to have been 'passed on' from Sutcliffe rather than 'Jack...' directly. It has been attached because of what appear to be similarities - in victimology and also in this case geographically. To Sutcliffe, yes, but to the original 1888 version very few. Via Sutcliffe, a case which had at least one additional similarity in the form of the 'Wearside Jack' hoax, it seems that 'Ripper' has come to mean simply 'prostitute murderer', and its origins in relation to the verb 'to rip' have been all but forgotten. I doubt a lot of people reading that headline today have any real idea of the fate of the original Ripper's victims.

That may please whoever is responsible for these latest murders but perhaps one consolation is it would likely mightily p*ss off 'Jack'.

[Rigby]

Which he is going to struggle to deny that he owned:

http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/uk/bradford+murder+suspect+amazon+book+wishlist/3661142

I so wish the media would drop all Ripper connections and connotations as if this was him and if Oor Jack and (Fellow-Bradfordian) Petey Sutcliffe are his inspiration then such titular adulation is exactly what he wanted.