JFK a new twist

[Tom_Wescott]

Personally, I think the 'accident' theory is crap, for the simple reason that Kennedy was struck by more than one bullet. I really would like to believe that Oswald acted alone, but whenever I see the Zapruder Film and the 'head jerk-back', it does make me think that one shot, at least, came from Kennedy's front. And then, of course, why should Ruby really want to kill Oswald? Because he felt sorry for Mrs Kennedy? He had Mafia and police connections and had been to Cuba, possibly at least once. To my simple mind, Ruby killed Oswald before he, Oswald, could talk.

I too have been to Dealey Plaza, in 1978. If it was just Oswald, it was damn fine shooting with an old and worn rifle.

No, there's more to this than meets the eye, but we'll probably never know.

Graham

Well, there was plenty of time to kill Oswald after the assassination. He could not drive and had absolutely no escape plan. He 'escaped' on a city bus and then took a cab. From there he was on foot. If the assassination had been planned as part of a conspiracy, there would have been a car waiting to whisk him away because...as you said...they couldn't risk him talking. After his arrest he was in custody for two days. Two days of grueling interrogation. Ruby had the opportunity to kill Oswald after he'd been in custody only hours. Ruby was at the police station (where he knew all the cops) with a gun in his pocket, but he had no interest at that time. This was after it was announced on the TV that Oswald was suspected of the murders of Kennedy and officer J. D. Tippitt.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Graham]

Personally, I think the 'accident' theory is crap, for the simple reason that Kennedy was struck by more than one bullet. I really would like to believe that Oswald acted alone, but whenever I see the Zapruder Film and the 'head jerk-back', it does make me think that one shot, at least, came from Kennedy's front. And then, of course, why should Ruby really want to kill Oswald? Because he felt sorry for Mrs Kennedy? He had Mafia and police connections and had been to Cuba, possibly at least once. To my simple mind, Ruby killed Oswald before he, Oswald, could talk.

I too have been to Dealey Plaza, in 1978. If it was just Oswald, it was damn fine shooting with an old and worn rifle.

No, there's more to this than meets the eye, but we'll probably never know.

Graham

[Tom_Wescott]

That's interesting, Mayerling. And we're funny like that. We Americans like our historic bullet holes. As a child growing up in Missouri I'd visit some family in the town of Carthage, where Jesse James and his gang had a shoot out. The holes are still in the walls and I was able to stick my little finger in there.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[j.r-ahde]

Hello you all!

There will always be theories for the following reasons:


1. The presumed assasin was shot by a night-club owner.

2. The president's brother got shot, while running for a candidacy for president.

All the best
Jukka

[Mayerling]

It's funny but there is a similar theory of "friendly fire" assassination for Huey Long. While the official version is that Dr. Carl Austin Weiss shot Long in the Louisiana Capitol Building in Baton Rouge in September 1935, there is some strains of evidence that Long's body guard (who were trigger happy) shot the "Kingfish" while killing Weiss (whose body was shot to pieces). The Louisiana State Capitol Building never had its walls repaired - the bullet holes are stil there.

[Wickerman]

The scenario that 'ticks' all the boxes is the controversy between Sam Giancana & Bobby Kennedy, the attempted assassination of Fidel Castro, the alliance between Giancana & the CIA, and the threat to "cut off the head of the dog" - a reference to John Kennedy.
Both Ruby & Oswald were small fish in this grand scheme, and apparently all the pieces fell into place.

In order to place yourself at arms length from any incident Sam Giancana claimed that you should, "kill the guy, who kills the guy, who killed the guy".

[Tom_Wescott]

Yes, but he was arrested for the murder of JD Tippet.

He was a suspect for the Kennedy murder at the same time. He was arrested for both crimes but not charged for many hours. Ruby already knew he was Kennedy's murderer.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

However, Ruby's movements from the time of the assassination to the murder of Oswald are well known and there's nothing to suggest conspiracy. In fact, Ruby was in the same room as Oswald following Oswald's arrest.

Yes, but he was arrested for the murder of JD Tippet.

[Tom_Wescott]

You're right. What got the conspiracy ideas off the ground was Ruby's murder of Oswald. Had Oswald lived and confessed there'd be no conspiracy theories. But that wasn't allowed to happen. However, Ruby's movements from the time of the assassination to the murder of Oswald are well known and there's nothing to suggest conspiracy. In fact, Ruby was in the same room as Oswald following Oswald's arrest. It was the day before he murdered him. He had his gun on him but had no interest in killing him. It was probably a case of Ruby being caught up in the moment, surrounded by soooo many cameras. He genuinely liked Kennedy and his family and in that moment realized he could be a 'hero'. It didn't occur to him that what he was about to do would screw up the world. He was only thinking of himself.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Barnaby]

It might genuinely be as simple as Oswald did it alone.

This is what one is almost forced to conclude given the preponderance of the evidence. People don't want to believe that the course of history can be changed by a loser who made a lucky shot.

The only thing that gives me any pause is Jack Ruby's murder of Oswald. What the hell was he thinking if the purpose was not to silence Oswald? I don't believe in a massive conspiracy theory, but perhaps some organization had some contact with Oswald - then seeing what he did rather independently - didn't want that contact made public.

[Tom_Wescott]

Most books on the assassination are so convoluted as to be almost impossible to read, particularly the ones that back a Cuban theory. The conspiracy theory books are on the whole severely flawed in fundamental ways. But then again, so is the Warren report. However, there's a new book out by the last surviving member of the Warren Commission (one of the people who actually did the research), which I purchased and look forward to reading.

It might genuinely be as simple as Oswald did it alone. I go back and forth on the matter a lot.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

I've read so many books on this assassination that today I don't bother with it any more. Anyone really interested should use the Warren Commission Report if they need to know the 'facts'.
On the other hand, it is known that the Secret Service refused to let the official autopsy surgeon in Dallas do his duty - this was a major mistake.
They flew the body to Bethesda Medical Centre and ordered two military doctors not trained as physicians or autopsy surgeons to conduct the autopsy. Numerous mistakes were made by these two military doctors - they were out of their depth.

NOVA just recently offered a TV special on this very controversial subject.

[Tom_Wescott]

I understand Oswald payed $13 for this bolt-action weapon. Not the most ideal weapon for an attempted assassination. In the same magazine there were repeat-action and automatic weapons much more suitable, but maybe $16-25 was beyond his finances.

I believe it was just over $20 after shipping. It was a 23 year old Italian gun with bad sights. Oswald was only a year older than the gun.

A couple of facts I found interesting is that Oswald was in custody for over two hours before they thought to search his person. Also interesting is that killing a president was not a capital crime in 1963. It was local, like any other murder.

Mortal Error is a good book but I don't think it's the answer. The witnesses close to the book depository heard the gunshots come from the 6th floor. The shots echoed around the square which is why people thought they heard shots come from the grassy knoll area.

I have yet to be to London but I have been to Dealey Plaza! There's an 'x' in the road on the spot where Kennedy was shot.

I must say I'm impressed with how Jackie made it through that day, the plane ride back with Johnson, and maintained her composure. If you look at the longshot version of the photo where she's standing next to Johnson as he's being sworn in (by a female judge, no less...who knew they had those then) she has pieces of brain on her clothes.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

I understand Oswald payed $13 for this bolt-action weapon. Not the most ideal weapon for an attempted assassination. In the same magazine there were repeat-action and automatic weapons much more suitable, but maybe $16-25 was beyond his finances.

[sdreid]

CBS is doing a program about the assassination in about 20 minutes.