Dyatlov Pass incident

[Ms Diddles]

I haven’t read of any Mansi that found the tent Ms D? It was a search party of 10 led by Boris Slobtsov who was a student and a friend of Dyatlvov’s (apparently there were no profession searchers in his party) He decided that they’d have a better chance of success if they broke off into pairs and he paired up with a guy called Mikhail Sharavin and those two found the tent.

Im sounding a bit ‘knowledgeable’ here but I’m just quoting from Dead Mountain

Hi Herlock,

The Pavlov book states that a message was received from Ivdel advising that Mansi hunters had discovered the campsite.

This is also ringing a vague bell with me, as I feel like I have read this elsewhere too.

I'm wondering if the hunters on the ground spotted the site and reported back to the authorities, after which the search teams were rerouted to the correct spot based on the Mansi reports, ultimately discovering the site as you state above??

I'm not going to give anything away about the Pavlov book as I know you are yet to read it (unless you've done your crazy osmosis thing and taken it out already??) but it does seem to be extremely thorough on the whole search process.

It's on P65.

See what you make of it when you get to it.....

It appears there are so many conflicting reports about every aspect of the case, so it's extremely hard to discern which sources are accurate.

[Enigma]

Welcome Filby. I had read the same article you mention which presents a plausible explanation.

[Filby]

welcome filby
i would tend to agree with this.

Thanks for the welcome!

[Abby Normal]

I'd like to first introduce myself as a newbie to Casebook, however I've been following the forums for the past couple years. I would like to chime in on the Dyatlov Incident. I've read Dead Mountain as well but was never convinced of the wind vortex/disassociation of reality factor as the direct cause. Recently, I ran across a very good (and convincing) article in National Geographic issue (2021) explaining, as originally suspected by the survival-rescue crew, an avalanche occurred. The team, in fact, misread the grade of the slope as a key danger factor. National Geographic issue claimed that new analysis from the Disney's "Frozen" animation/engineer's ingenious calculus that predicts nearly real snow motion (the calculus is actually written out on his own separate website/article) as to how the avalanche/event happened with so little disruption. And the fact that others removed clothing from the dead bodies in an attempt to survive. Predators probably took the eye/facial organs. I found this much more convincing than the book.

welcome filby
i would tend to agree with this.

[Filby]

I'd like to first introduce myself as a newbie to Casebook, however I've been following the forums for the past couple years. I would like to chime in on the Dyatlov Incident. I've read Dead Mountain as well but was never convinced of the wind vortex/disassociation of reality factor as the direct cause. Recently, I ran across a very good (and convincing) article in National Geographic issue (2021) explaining, as originally suspected by the survival-rescue crew, an avalanche occurred. The team, in fact, misread the grade of the slope as a key danger factor. National Geographic issue claimed that new analysis from the Disney's "Frozen" animation/engineer's ingenious calculus that predicts nearly real snow motion (the calculus is actually written out on his own separate website/article) as to how the avalanche/event happened with so little disruption. And the fact that others removed clothing from the dead bodies in an attempt to survive. Predators probably took the eye/facial organs. I found this much more convincing than the book.

[Abby Normal]

That's true for MOST so-called "mysteries"- from the Bermuda Triangle to most UFOs to The Mary Celeste to Kaspar Hauser to The Man in he "Iron Mask", etc., etc. They have reasonable explanations that are ignored for some sort of Conspiracy Theory/Government Plot/Supernatural Event explanation 'cause that's what sells.

Bingo!!!!!

[C. F. Leon]

Hi all,
I have followed this mystery for about ten years now.

When I first came across it, I too felt "How Wierd "

But since then, I have read quite a bit about it and there are really quite a few reasonable explanations...even for the weird stuff.
...
Regards

That's true for MOST so-called "mysteries"- from the Bermuda Triangle to most UFOs to The Mary Celeste to Kaspar Hauser to The Man in he "Iron Mask", etc., etc. They have reasonable explanations that are ignored for some sort of Conspiracy Theory/Government Plot/Supernatural Event explanation 'cause that's what sells.

[Herlock Sholmes]

It's certainly possible.

Or one of Mansi hunters who initially located the campsite moved things around a bit, although I'm unsure of whether they actually went right up to the site, or spotted it from a distance and alerted the authorities.

More questions than answers here I'm afraid.

I haven’t read of any Mansi that found the tent Ms D? It was a search party of 10 led by Boris Slobtsov who was a student and a friend of Dyatlvov’s (apparently there were no profession searchers in his party) He decided that they’d have a better chance of success if they broke off into pairs and he paired up with a guy called Mikhail Sharavin and those two found the tent.

Im sounding a bit ‘knowledgeable’ here but I’m just quoting from Dead Mountain

[Ms Diddles]

From the website:

‘On the side of the tent on top of 10 cm of snow laid Dyatlov's flashlight (made in China). Boris Slobtsov picked it up and turned it on - the flashlight was in working condition.’

It is strange how it got there though because the tent didn’t have a flat top so i can’t see how it could have been there before the tent collapsed? The only thing that I can’t suggest is that it’s connected to the large holes in the side of the tend where there was cloth missing. If the tent collapsed with these holes in the side could the torch have been in the gap and then strong wing blew the torch on top of the fallen canvas?

That’s all that I can come up with at the moment.

It's certainly possible.

Or one of Mansi hunters who initially located the campsite moved things around a bit, although I'm unsure of whether they actually went right up to the site, or spotted it from a distance and alerted the authorities.

More questions than answers here I'm afraid.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Interesting, Herlock!

Did it say whether the one found on top of the tent was also in the "on" position?

If it was switched off my theory that it was left there as a beacon to show them the location of the tent has just imploded!

If what you read is indeed correct, it's weird that it was sitting on top of 10cm of snow.

I suppose that supports the avalanche theory, or else one of the searchers moved it and didn't fess up.

From the website:

‘On the side of the tent on top of 10 cm of snow laid Dyatlov's flashlight (made in China). Boris Slobtsov picked it up and turned it on - the flashlight was in working condition.’

It is strange how it got there though because the tent didn’t have a flat top so i can’t see how it could have been there before the tent collapsed? The only thing that I can’t suggest is that it’s connected to the large holes in the side of the tend where there was cloth missing. If the tent collapsed with these holes in the side could the torch have been in the gap and then strong wing blew the torch on top of the fallen canvas?

That’s all that I can come up with at the moment.

[Ms Diddles]

Re the torch/flashlight. I was a little confused when I read about a torch that was in ‘working order’ when I’d read that the torch was in the ‘on’ position but the battery was dead so I checked Dyatlov.Com. There were actually 2 torches/flashlights found. One was found on top of the tent with 10cm of snow underneath it by Slobtsov. The torch belonged to Dyatlov and it was in working order. The second torch however was found 450m down the slope. This one was in the ‘on’ position but the battery was dead.

Interesting, Herlock!

Did it say whether the one found on top of the tent was also in the "on" position?

If it was switched off, my theory that it was left there as a beacon so they could locate the tent in the dark has just imploded!

If what you read is indeed correct, it's weird that it was sitting on top of 10cm of snow.

I suppose that supports the avalanche theory, or else one of the searchers moved it and didn't fess up.

[Herlock Sholmes]

Re the torch/flashlight. I was a little confused when I read about a torch that was in ‘working order’ when I’d read that the torch was in the ‘on’ position but the battery was dead so I checked Dyatlov.Com. There were actually 2 torches/flashlights found. One was found on top of the tent with 10cm of snow underneath it by Slobtsov. The torch belonged to Dyatlov and it was in working order. The second torch however was found 450m down the slope. This one was in the ‘on’ position but the battery was dead.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I think that the main argument against the infrasound theory is that it only affects a relatively small number of people.

Only a couple of the nine hikers would likely have been susceptible, so the unaffected majority would have been able to subdue them if they started acting hysterically.

Again I'm simply regurgitating things I've read.

I don't claim enough scientific knowledge to be able to properly assess these things.

The same goes for the radiation.

Some reports claim the levels were high enough to be of significance, Eichar discounts this.

Then of course there are the contradictory studies into the likelihood of an avalanche......

I agree the Mansi are off the hook, and the escaped convicts theory doesn't hold up, an animal attack doesn't fit and it certainly wasn't a yeti or aliens (!!).

For me it's really avalanche v some weird Russian military thing.

Until avalanche is incontrovertibly eliminated, I lean that way simply playing the odds.

I was a little confused as to why only 4 of the hikers were tested for radiation but it seems that when Ivanov interviewed a volunteer called Brusnytsin he told Ivanov that the only possible reason for a panic would have been an outside phenomenon rather than a group member. He suggested mysterious lights or some kind of gas. But when Ivanov ordered the tests for radiation it seems that the first 5 hikers had already been buried.

The infrasound is weird but has science behind it. Apparently the Israeli’s have used it in crowd control.

[Ms Diddles]

Well I just finished Dead Mountain. The author proposes the Infrasound theory which sounded a bit mad to me initially until I read it. The phenomena is backed by genuine science so it’s not a kind of fringe thing. There’s no way of proving this of course but an expert on the subject pointed out that the domed shape of the top of the mountain is the ideal shape for creating infrasound. The author had initially wondered if Boot Rock was ideal for it but apparently it’s too uneven and jagged (apparently architects design buildings with plenty of shaped and indentation to avoid the creation of infrasound. It creates disorientation, nausea, fear, irrational behaviour and more. The authors suggested scenario appears quite plausible and explains pretty much everything. Whether it’s the solution or not is another matter. The book is definitely worth reading though. The avalanche theory gets dismissed (I’m not saying correctly or incorrectly)

Of the theories that I’ve read of so far Id certainly eliminate The Mansi, an animal (like a bear,) a Yeti, or a UFO. I’m not a fan of ‘lights in the sky’ type explanations for anything but there were people claiming to have seen ‘fireballs.’ Maybe it’s not impossible that whatever these were (natural phenomena or something being tested, like weapons) they might have triggered an avalanche? The escaped Gulag prisoner seems very unlikely and I’m not keen on the spying/assassin team scenario either.

One thing that this book did tell me, and the point maybe contested elsewhere, is that the radiation levels found were next to nothing. The levels would have had to have been 50 to 100 times more to have been a concern. This kind of contamination can occur naturally and be transmitted through the air.

I think that the main argument against the infrasound theory is that it only affects a relatively small number of people.

Only a couple of the nine hikers would likely have been susceptible, so the unaffected majority would have been able to subdue them if they started acting hysterically.

Again I'm simply regurgitating things I've read.

I don't claim enough scientific knowledge to be able to properly assess these things.

The same goes for the radiation.

Some reports claim the levels were high enough to be of significance, Eichar discounts this.

Then of course there are the contradictory studies into the likelihood of an avalanche......

I agree the Mansi are off the hook, and the escaped convicts theory doesn't hold up, an animal attack doesn't fit and it certainly wasn't a yeti or aliens (!!).

For me it's really avalanche v some weird Russian military thing.

Until avalanche is incontrovertibly eliminated, I lean that way simply playing the odds.

[Ms Diddles]

If the hike had been successful they would have all gained their grade 3’s which would have allowed them to teach (hiking I assume) as a Master Of Sport. The route that was agreed upon was classified as sufficiently difficult to justify the grade 3 award. I believe that grade 3 was the highest although I’m not certain.

Yeah, I'm sure it was the highest grade, and quite a prestigious award to attain.

One of the things I find quite poignant about this case is how wholesome and earnest the young hikers seem from their letters home and diary entries.

They seem simultaneously very young and terribly old, but I suppose they were probably typical of young Russians at that time.