Funny headline from where I live

[Limehouse]

For profit health care must be concerned with profit? Oh my god dude I didn't know that thanks so much for filling me in. EVERYONE is concerned with profit and making money! This notion of 'I'm not in it for the money' is BS nobody thinks that way, come on. Who mentioned anything about vouchers? I've never typed a posting about that at all on here.Bottom line is if some people on the board think that smoking should be outlawed on sidewalks to benefit the 'greater good', that Cuba is a thriving oasis in the Caribbean, and that health insurers are akin to Drug Dealers and pimps then fine, think that way. I chose however to think that these are extreme and dangerous opinions to have
Jordan

Jordan, this thread started off well, and I was perfectly prepared to have a sensible debate. However, you persist in mis-quoting and mis-representing what other poster have written.

The one and only thing I wrote about Cuba was concerning its healthcare service which does not treat people on their ability to pay.

The points I made about smoking were that the government has a duty to inform people about the dangers of smoking and they have a duty to protect citzens from other people's actions (breathing in their smoke).

Maybe I am getting old, but it seems to me my points are reasonable and don't add up to me being the kind of citizen who should be regarded with suspicion.

One last thing, I have highlighted you comment about - everybody is concerned with profit and money'. With respect Jordan, I think you are going to struggle a bit if you go through life believing this.

[Cogidubnus]

My health's fine Jordan (well as fine as it might be bearing in mind the circumstances!) and I offer up my own case just as an example of how things might be....

All the best

Dave

[ChainzCooper]

Wow hope your health is going okay Dave
Jordan

[Cogidubnus]

You've got to respect the NHS

As someone who last November had a minor heart attack and was subsequently diagnosed with Angina, I've surely just got to place myself at Ally's side haven't I?

For the record, the much maligned UK National Health Service (which I've never much used in the past) have been absolutely f***ingly brilliant...I had all tests and an angiogram on the first day I turned up ill...I've had my overall situation totally laid out, and my choices identified...I've been tested and fully informed of my options, and I have to say, I've not only been respectfully treated, but I've been offered (absolutely free) MRI Scans just to confirm the right diagnosis has been made...(in fact everything bar the drugs has been totally free at point of delivery)....

We in the UK moan and complain of having to pay a fee for prescription drugs...well yes we do...over £7 for an individual shot...but by pre-paying on a monthly direct debit I get the seven prescriptions per day I need for only £10.40 per month...that's just over $16 ...and if I hadn't been in work it would've been totally free...to me that's brilliant...no arguments even considered!

All the best

Dave

[Ally]

Yeah I can tell you took the time to actually read and acquire knowledge before coming back with your rote idiocy. Bye now, off to more intelligent debate.

[ChainzCooper]

Are you insane? On the one hand you post this: "This notion of 'I'm not in it for the money' is BS nobody thinks that way, come on." And then you ask if I honestly think no one in health insurance cares about their customers. OF COURSE THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT THEIR CUSTOMERS.

If they cared about their customers, they wouldn't deny procedures saying they aren't needed when the patients DOCTORS say they are. Insurance companies are refusing to pay for procedures, even when they patient will die if they don't get it. You think that's "caring for their customers"? When a teenager dies because the insurance company wouldn't pay for the liver transplant? or the five year old who would have died because the insurance company refused to pay for his cancer treatment? A tab that was paid for by the tax payer instead??

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?se...ors&id=8433265

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...ataline15.html

http://kansascity.legalexaminer.com/...oogleid=284354

Or what about the thousands of routine tests to screen that patients are denied? Denied coverage for MRIs that would early detect cancer, and which go undiagnosed until it's too late?

Google and read how many people are denied preventive care by their insurance companies and then are denied care once they are diagnosed. WAKE THE EFF UP.

Read how many people can't even GET insurance because they have an illness that is entirely beyond their control, or denied because they had asthma as a child.

Read how many people had their insurance cancelled when they were diagnosed with an illness after they had paid all their insurance premiums faithfully.

You really have no clue. Of course insurance companies don't care about their customers. They care about the PROFIT. And you don't make a profit if you pay money for things like tests and life-saving procedures.

Health care, and I know this is hard to understand, is actually NECESSARY to maintaining ones life. More even than the POLICE FORCE you pay for, the FIRE DEPARTMENT you pay for, THE ROAD SYSTEM you pay for -- ALL not for profit. And yet, when it comes to actually KEEPING PEOPLE ALIVE, suddenly "for profit" and the bottom line is vital. It's very interesting what morons in this society prioritize. Road maintenance is apparently more important than body maintenance. Daft freaking idjits.

For some reason you equate making profit with not caring about anyone. Sorry if that makes me insane for questioning this notion. Businesses (including health insurance) are in it not only to make money but to also help their customers! Insurers are not evil people they're people just like you and me! Do you really think insurers pay out ZERO claims that are filed? This is clearly not the case
Jordan

[Ally]

Thats not a rhetorical question! I was asking if you honestly think no one in health insurance cares about their customers
Jordan

Are you insane? On the one hand you post this: "This notion of 'I'm not in it for the money' is BS nobody thinks that way, come on." And then you ask if I honestly think no one in health insurance cares about their customers. OF COURSE THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT THEIR CUSTOMERS.

If they cared about their customers, they wouldn't deny procedures saying they aren't needed when the patients DOCTORS say they are. Insurance companies are refusing to pay for procedures, even when they patient will die if they don't get it. You think that's "caring for their customers"? When a teenager dies because the insurance company wouldn't pay for the liver transplant? or the five year old who would have died because the insurance company refused to pay for his cancer treatment? A tab that was paid for by the tax payer instead??

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?se...ors&id=8433265

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...ataline15.html

http://kansascity.legalexaminer.com/...oogleid=284354

Or what about the thousands of routine tests to screen that patients are denied? Denied coverage for MRIs that would early detect cancer, and which go undiagnosed until it's too late?

Google and read how many people are denied preventive care by their insurance companies and then are denied care once they are diagnosed. WAKE THE EFF UP.

Read how many people can't even GET insurance because they have an illness that is entirely beyond their control, or denied because they had asthma as a child.

Read how many people had their insurance cancelled when they were diagnosed with an illness after they had paid all their insurance premiums faithfully.

You really have no clue. Of course insurance companies don't care about their customers. They care about the PROFIT. And you don't make a profit if you pay money for things like tests and life-saving procedures.

Health care, and I know this is hard to understand, is actually NECESSARY to maintaining ones life. More even than the POLICE FORCE you pay for, the FIRE DEPARTMENT you pay for, THE ROAD SYSTEM you pay for -- ALL not for profit. And yet, when it comes to actually KEEPING PEOPLE ALIVE, suddenly "for profit" and the bottom line is vital. It's very interesting what morons in this society prioritize. Road maintenance is apparently more important than body maintenance. Daft freaking idjits.

[ChainzCooper]

Jordan,

Let me explain some things to you. For profit health care must be concerned primarily with profit. This means that paying for medical procedures that would reduce profit, is against the whole purpose of the system. That's why it doesn't work right. That's why officers in the corporations are always trying to find ways to NOT have to pay for procedures. There are good people that do care in the companies, but it isn't the board of directors.

Vouchers: I shouldn't get started on that, but it's the same thing. The idea of privatizing education sounds great to many people. They think it means choice. What it will mean is cutting costs, more students in classrooms, and the real reason for having the system: Dissolution of a perceived liberal power base, i.e., the teachers' union.

Your see it isn't about freedom of choice for parents. It was what idiot parents believe, but it isn't what the plan is. The plan is to undermine the liberal power base thereby strengthening the conservative one. It has nothing to do with religion, choice, or better education except to the blind automatons who listen to the drivel. It's about regaining power. It's that simple.

Glad I could help.

Mike

For profit health care must be concerned with profit? Oh my god dude I didn't know that thanks so much for filling me in. EVERYONE is concerned with profit and making money! This notion of 'I'm not in it for the money' is BS nobody thinks that way, come on. Who mentioned anything about vouchers? I've never typed a posting about that at all on here.Bottom line is if some people on the board think that smoking should be outlawed on sidewalks to benefit the 'greater good', that Cuba is a thriving oasis in the Caribbean, and that health insurers are akin to Drug Dealers and pimps then fine, think that way. I chose however to think that these are extreme and dangerous opinions to have
Jordan

[ChainzCooper]

Are you capable of doing anything other than asking rhetorical questions?

Thats not a rhetorical question! I was asking if you honestly think no one in health insurance cares about their customers
Jordan

[The Good Michael]

Jordan,

Let me explain some things to you. For profit health care must be concerned primarily with profit. This means that paying for medical procedures that would reduce profit, is against the whole purpose of the system. That's why it doesn't work right. That's why officers in the corporations are always trying to find ways to NOT have to pay for procedures. There are good people that do care in the companies, but it isn't the board of directors.

Vouchers: I shouldn't get started on that, but it's the same thing. The idea of privatizing education sounds great to many people. They think it means choice. What it will mean is cutting costs, more students in classrooms, and the real reason for having the system: Dissolution of a perceived liberal power base, i.e., the teachers' union.

Your see it isn't about freedom of choice for parents. It was what idiot parents believe, but it isn't what the plan is. The plan is to undermine the liberal power base thereby strengthening the conservative one. It has nothing to do with religion, choice, or better education except to the blind automatons who listen to the drivel. It's about regaining power. It's that simple.

Glad I could help.

Mike

[Ally]

Nobody in health insurance gives a crap about their customers health? Are you serious?
Jordan

Are you capable of doing anything other than asking rhetorical questions?

[Cogidubnus]

I don't know Dave, which of the two types of posters would you file me under?

Certainly not in the same category as Limehouse.

Dave

[Limehouse]

Cuba is a dump ask the millions of refugees in Florida and around the U.S. how great Castro is. He stole people's businesses and lands all for himself so that makes him a hero? Cuba has even now admitted that they got it wrong with this BS Che' revolution in opening the first Restaurant since the Batista regime this year
Jordan

My comments were confined to Cuba's health care, which is known world-wide to be excellent. I didn't even mention Castro.

[Limehouse]

Yeah thats right lets share our money with others fairly. I think I'll start by cashing my next paycheck and go around town handing out money to bums on the street because thats only fair
Jordan

That's not what my post implied at all. I mentioned nothing at all about people on streets. I wrote that PROFIT should be shared fairly. That means paying producers a fair price for their raw products and paying staff a fair price for their labour. It's all about ethical business practices.

[ChainzCooper]

Hi Jordan (?)

Trouble is, when it comes to a set of postings like this, lots of us with no particular first-hand experience, have to form opinions based on what we can research, (usually books, internet, or similar), and what we know of the relevant posters...

So bearing in mind that libraries or search-engines MAY only show what a regime wishes to show, (and we're well aware of this), we look at posters and their pedigree...should we trust and believe somebody who always posts in full and clearly has a social conscience or somebody who inevitably sits on the sidelines and posts the occasional cryptic or sarcastic comment?

You tell me

Dave

I don't know Dave, which of the two types of posters would you file me under?
Jordan