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  • Originally posted by OneRound View Post
    Hi Herlock - not for the first time Spitfire has beaten me to it. I was going to recommend the Court of Appeal's 2002 judgement not only as reading material but also as a starting point. Whilst some here can and do quibble with the odd bit, it sets out known facts and background pretty methodically.

    Although the Court make a strong case for Hanratty's guilt, they leave me unconvinced that it was fairly proven. Anyway that's just my humble opinion. I'll leave you to your own reading and conclusions.

    Btw, I don't know the Razen book.

    Best regards,

    OneRound
    Thanks for that OneRound,

    As the Wallace thread is silent at the moment I thought that I might Ďbranch out.í
    Regards

    Herlock






    "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Graham View Post
      A few comments on the Razen Book (more of a pamphlet, actually) can be found here: http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?p=309811. It's OK, but I wasn't impressed. His standard of English I thought rather poor, too.

      Another (now rare) book is Shadows Of Deadman's Hill by Leonard Miller, who is convinced that Hanratty was guilty. He refutes many of the standard arguments, especially regarding the Liverpool and Rhyl Alibis, but of course there are posters to these boards who may not agree with him! I think it was Derrick who said that the publisher (Zoilus Press) printed only 1000 copies. At one time a few years ago copies were being advertised on the net for over £600! I wonder if anyone ever paid that sort of money. I wasn't tempted to sell my copy, have to say.

      I agree that the Court of Appeal Judgment should also be on your reading list.

      Graham
      Thanks for that Graham

      Iím considering dipping a tentative toe into the Hanratty case.
      Regards

      Herlock






      "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
        I know next to nothing about the Hanratty case so id like a bit of advice about books from those that do. Just a couple of quick reviews would be helpful

        Hanratty: The Final Verdict - Woffinden.

        Hanratty: The Inconvenient Truth - Razen

        Who Killed Hanratty? - Foot.

        Thanks all
        Herlock
        I'd give the Razan a wide berth until you've read at least Woffinden.
        But you may wish to read Blom-Cooper and Lord Russell first, then Foot.
        My 2d's worth.
        Del

        Comment


        • Cheers Del,

          Thanks for the advice. Much appreciated. I've just ordered the Woffinden book from Ebay for less than £3.
          Regards

          Herlock






          "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

          Comment


          • Ive read half of the Court Of Appeal transcript and it seems to these laymanís eyes so far - overwhelmingly guilty. Ill read the rest tomorrow while i wait for the Woffinden book
            Regards

            Herlock






            "There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact!"

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
              Ive read half of the Court Of Appeal transcript and it seems to these laymanís eyes so far - overwhelmingly guilty. Ill read the rest tomorrow while i wait for the Woffinden book
              Good effort, Herlock! I don't disagree with you but see if you can spot where I think the Court of Appeal went very easy on Acott. Some might regard death as being a good career move for the copper who headed the A6 investigation.

              Best regards,

              OneRound

              Comment


              • Mary Lanz and the Hanrattys

                Miller (pp. 23-4) in describing the reburial of Hanratty at Carpenders Park on Feb 22, 1966, runs through the people who were invited back to the Hanrattys' home afterwards, among them Paul Foot (sent by the Sunday Telegraph and about to become hooked on the case) and the core of the A6 Committee. One name - that of Mary Lanz - seemed out of place to me. Surely she'd have had only the most fleeting of connections with Justice and Fox, and none at all with the Hanratty family? So what was she doing there?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Alfie View Post
                  Miller (pp. 23-4) in describing the reburial of Hanratty at Carpenders Park on Feb 22, 1966, runs through the people who were invited back to the Hanrattys' home afterwards, among them Paul Foot (sent by the Sunday Telegraph and about to become hooked on the case) and the core of the A6 Committee. One name - that of Mary Lanz - seemed out of place to me. Surely she'd have had only the most fleeting of connections with Justice and Fox, and none at all with the Hanratty family? So what was she doing there?
                  She said that Gregsten and Valerie had been in The Old Station Inn on several occasions prior to the fateful evening. Justice also claims that he took Fox and Alphon to the Old Station on the night he claims they went the cornfield, and asked Mrs Lanz if she recognised either of his two friends. She indicated Alphon as a man she had seen in her pub previously. Even though she repeated this statement to the police, it was never proven, and I find it slightly dodgy. It sounds to me as though she was another person in the overall A6 picture who 'wanted to get in on the act'.

                  I can only surmise that she was invited to the Hanratty house after the re-internment because it was considered that she had evidence proving that Alphon was connected with the case.

                  Graham
                  We are suffering from a plethora of surmise, conjecture and hypothesis. - Sherlock Holmes, The Adventure Of Silver Blaze

                  Comment


                  • Foot's account of the event and the persuasive powers of Jean Justice:

                    "‘There may be trouble there,’ the news editor beamed. ‘This chap Alphon may cause a fuss.’ I had no idea who Alphon was, and after the burial in Wembley, I was none the wiser. There was nothing to report, so I gladly accepted the invitation of James and Mary Hanratty to join the wake for their son in their council house in Kingsbury. The Hanrattys were warm, gentle, determined people, unlikely parents of a man who had been convicted of shooting Michael Gregsten dead in a lay-by off the A6, raping his girlfriend Valerie Storie and then shooting her, leaving her for dead before driving off in the couple’s car. Among the guests at the wake were Jean Justice, who told me he was a (rather elderly) law student, and his friend, a barrister called Jeremy Fox. I listened entranced to their assurances not only that Jimmy Hanratty had nothing to do with the A6 murder, but that they had been on intimate terms with the real killer: Peter Alphon.
                    I was hooked on the case that gloomy February afternoon and, nearly 32 years later, I still am. Bob Woffinden’s new book has revived the intoxicating mixture of anguish and curiosity with which Jean Justice inspired me all those years ago. Since that time I have been, as I still am, quite certain that Hanratty was in Rhyl when the couple were shot near Bedford 250 miles away."

                    Comment


                    • I listened entranced to their assurances not only that Jimmy Hanratty had nothing to do with the A6 murder, but that they had been on intimate terms with the real killer: Peter Alphon.
                      But later, Foot admitted that he had changed his mind about Janet Gregsten being the motivating force behind the murder, and he also said that after much consideration he came to realise and Alphon didn't know as much about the A6 Case as he, Alphon, made out.

                      Personally, I could never quite take Justice very seriously.

                      Graham
                      We are suffering from a plethora of surmise, conjecture and hypothesis. - Sherlock Holmes, The Adventure Of Silver Blaze

                      Comment


                      • According to the report in 1966 in the Sunday Telegraph, David Lewis a doctor/surgeon at Bedford General Hospital was present at the funeral.

                        Mary Lanz was driven to the funeral by her son Ian, who had worked at the Road Research Institute with Valerie Storie and Michael Gregsten.
                        Last edited by Spitfire; 06-04-2018, 02:08 PM.

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                        • Ian was reported as saying that he knew Valerie and Michael quite well and told Foot that he had tried to get Val to stop seeing Mike as he thought no good could come of it.
                          Last edited by Spitfire; 06-04-2018, 02:12 PM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Spitfire View Post
                            Ian was reported as saying that he knew Valerie and Michael quite well and told Foot that he had tried to get Val to stop seeing Mike as he thought no good could come of it.
                            That's news to me, Spitfire, and adds another little nugget of interesting information to the overall picture. May I ask where you discovered this, as neither Woffinden nor Foot mention it?

                            I wonder if Ian Lanz might be the unknown person who wrote to the Director of the Road Research Laboratory concerning the illicit relationship between Gregsten and Valerie?

                            Graham
                            We are suffering from a plethora of surmise, conjecture and hypothesis. - Sherlock Holmes, The Adventure Of Silver Blaze

                            Comment


                            • I'd assumed, maybe wrongly, that Spitfire was quoting from the report Paul Foot filed in the Sunday Telegraph.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by NickB View Post
                                I'd assumed, maybe wrongly, that Spitfire was quoting from the report Paul Foot filed in the Sunday Telegraph.
                                Which I don't think I've seen. Anyone able to post it?

                                Graham
                                Last edited by Graham; 06-05-2018, 07:00 AM.
                                We are suffering from a plethora of surmise, conjecture and hypothesis. - Sherlock Holmes, The Adventure Of Silver Blaze

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