Worst serial killer(s)?

[Harry D]

Not a serial killer, but Issei Sagawa, the Japanese fella who murdered and cannibalized a young Dutch woman, Renée Hartevelt, whom he had a crush on, is a particularly ghastly tale for more than one reason. The murder took place in France, but the French authorities couldn't afford to keep him in a psychiatric ward so he was deported back to Japan, but Japanese courts couldn't prosecute him as France failed to send over the necessary paperwork. Sagawa walked out a free man and literally got away with murder. Incredibly, he went on to become a minor celebrity in Japan, appearing on chat shows, cooking programmes (...ugh) and even delving into the porn industry. Then again, this is Japan we're talking about, so not that incredible.

[Abby Normal]

When we are talking about the worst of the worst, we are of course talking about something very nebulous.

There are serial killers who committed far more heinous acts than others. Chase clearly committed far more heinous acts than say, Son of Sam. So if you are looking at actions, Chase wins. But Chase was irrevocably insane. Berkowitz did it for fame. Son of Sam's motive is more despicable than Chase. If you are looking a motivation, Berkowitz wins. If you are looking for monsters in our midst, You aren't going to get much better than Bundy. Pretty, popular, apparently normal Bundy. But he is also clearly a smug son of a bitch with no remorse and no desire to change. Bundy wins. But then there is Gein, whose life was tortured, who was bred to be a serial killer. Most of his crimes were inflicted on the dead. He had no choice. And he was never normal. But he made a woman suit and danced under the full moon. He kept a box of vulva's and lamp pulls made of lips. He has three major horror movie franchises based on him. He is the guy who has scared us the most, whether because we know of him or because we saw Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

For me, it's kids. You touch kids, you are done.

good post-and I agree. especially the kids part.

But I would add to that the number of victims and how many lives (family) were destroyed. and how heinous the crimes were-terrorizing, torture what was done to the victim.

so again, I go with the original nightstalker (uncaught-and hence still terrorizing the victims families in that regard) and then killers like Chikitilo, Bundy, BTK, wayne Williams, Gacy, Kemper and Dahmer.

[Errata]

When we are talking about the worst of the worst, we are of course talking about something very nebulous.

There are serial killers who committed far more heinous acts than others. Chase clearly committed far more heinous acts than say, Son of Sam. So if you are looking at actions, Chase wins. But Chase was irrevocably insane. Berkowitz did it for fame. Son of Sam's motive is more despicable than Chase. If you are looking a motivation, Berkowitz wins. If you are looking for monsters in our midst, You aren't going to get much better than Bundy. Pretty, popular, apparently normal Bundy. But he is also clearly a smug son of a bitch with no remorse and no desire to change. Bundy wins. But then there is Gein, whose life was tortured, who was bred to be a serial killer. Most of his crimes were inflicted on the dead. He had no choice. And he was never normal. But he made a woman suit and danced under the full moon. He kept a box of vulva's and lamp pulls made of lips. He has three major horror movie franchises based on him. He is the guy who has scared us the most, whether because we know of him or because we saw Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

For me, it's kids. You touch kids, you are done.

[Rosella]

Of course it didn't ALL go flawlessly. The money transfer affair at Guebwiller P.O. was an absolute farce. I've never read Bolitho on Troppman. Must look it up.

[Abby Normal]

the original nightstalker.

[Mayerling]

He has been compared (due to his comparative youth) to a modern juvenile delinquent, but his scheme to kill off the Kinck family was so well executed the description just does not fit him as well. Best account I ever read about Troppman was by William Bolitho in "Murder For Profit".

Jeff

[Rosella]

Troppman was a particularly revolting example. Cunning but disgusting.

[Mayerling]

Have to agree with Albert Fish, Bundy (I still see his narcissistic smirk in some pictures and want to go at him with a sledge hammer, Gacy, Dahlmer, Christie, Holmes - interesting how most of them are home grown U.S. models. Besides Christie maybe Heath and Haigh. France did give us Petiot.

One can make a case for how loathsome most of these characters are, even when insane. I could add Deeming, Cream, Chapman, Palmer, Troppman, a whole slew of them (no damned pun intended).

Jeff

[Harry D]

The Dali Killer left two corpse in the woods in Italy that were carved up like Dali paintings.

As for Chase against Bundy... like in a fight? In that case, Chase all the way because it's suicide to mess with crazy.

Serial killer face-offs? Haha. Not quite what I meant!

I meant, is Ted Bundy considered more despicable than Chase because he was fully conscious of what he was doing, whereas Chase was away with the faeries whilst he was hacking up the locals?

[Errata]

The Dali Killer left two corpse in the woods in Italy that were carved up like Dali paintings.

As for Chase against Bundy... like in a fight? In that case, Chase all the way because it's suicide to mess with crazy.

[Harry D]

Richard Chase was pretty screwed up. He killed a pregnant woman, raped her corpse whilst stabbing the body, then picked up some dog poop and went back and shoved it in her mouth. However, he was a paranoid schizophrenic who had lost grip of reality. How would he measure up against a cold, calculated sociopath like Bundy?

[kensei]

I'm thinking let's not only rate this by body count. I'd like to nominate a few of the more well known characters for their sheer sadism, viciousness, and just pure evil, even if they didn't kill hundreds of people.

Ted Bundy, the man for whom the term "serial killer" was first coined. His body count is unknown. It could be 40, it could be over 100. He kidnapped, raped and murdered attractive young women, dumped their bodies in remote areas, and sometimes went back and played with their bodies like they were dolls, even putting makeup on them. He sawed off a victim's head and kept it in his refrigerator for a while. His last victim was only 12 years old. And his sheer audacity in insisting he was innocent until the bitter end and then only beginning to admit guilt to try and live a little longer just makes one's blood boil. The electric chair finished him.

Richard Ramirez, "The Night Stalker." Thirteen victims known, probably a few more, and several others that survived. Surely killing people as human sacrifices to Satan qualifies him for special dishonorable mention. It was something he added to his career as a professional burglar which is how he made his living. Once he decided to start harming people, he knew no bounds. He tortured an elderly lady before he killed her by plugging in a severed electrical cord and shocking her with it. He raped women and then let them live after killing their husbands in front of them. If anyone ever swore to God that they didn't have any more valuables for him to steal he'd put a gun to their heads and angrily insist "NO, swear to Satan!" When one woman pulled a shotgun on him, forgetting that it was unloaded, this so angered him that after killing her he cut her eyes out and took them as trophies. Pure unfiltered evil. He died recently from liver falure, the result of bad prison tattoos, after languishing on death row for an insanely long time.

Dennis Rader, the BTK killer, his own made-up moniker whichs stood for "Bind, Torture, Kill." Ten victims. When you're so proud of how you sadistically torture people that you include it in your name, that says something. He began his serial killer career by wiping out most of an entire family. When caught he bragged about his crimes and reveled in all the attention. Today he rots in prison, amazed that no one wants to hear him talk anymore.

Albert Fish- I don't have all the details on this man handy at the moment such as his number of victims, but I remember enough. He lured little children, then raped, killed, butchered, cooked and ate them. Then he wrote letters to their parents bragging about what he'd done. It just doesn't get any more dark and evil than that.

And to Jack the Ripper, I would give the distinction of having committed one of the most singularly grotesque murders of all time, that of Mary Jane Kelly. Worse, even, than the Black Dahlia. Just reading the description of her complete disassembly and where all of her various parts were found around her body always makes me feel like I need a shower.

The worst serial killers, indeed.

[Rosella]

HH Holmes and the Villesca Axe murders before the First World War. In modern times Luis Garavito, the Beast, a Columbian serial killer with probably 400 victims, mostly anonymous street kids. Where would the Ripper rank if he were operating today? Probably nowhere. He is fascinating and unique for a number of other factors.

[Harry D]

The Dali Killer? Never heard of that one before.

[Errata]

The Dali Killer, but really only because I don't need that image in my head.