Ep. #39- A Diseased and Vile Creature: Thomas Cutbush

[Ally]

Huh. Remember what I said about AP being "flexible" with his stories?

From his book Jack the Myth:

One would have thought that this would have been the end of the sad tale, but no, far from it, for when the Essen police attempted to investigate the circumstances of the girl’s claims they were met with open hostility from the Bochum police force, but eventually they won through and consequently found overwhelming evidence that the local police had manifestly interfered with witness statements, misplaced and ‘lost’ files intentionally, and had indeed been harassing the girl because of her accusations against the son of one of their fellow officers.



That sure doesn't sound like they were all one police force to me. But you know, whatever twist to the story works at a given time.

Has he actually come up with any details that are RELEVANT to identifying this alleged case? But either way, it doesn't sound like those two police forces were chatting and spilling secrets of their investigation, now does it?

[Robert]

From AP : Bochum is part of the city of Essen and shares the same police force, much like the divisions of the Met.

[jmenges]

JM,

I can't find another rape/murder item in the Ruhr Valley, and that's searching in German too.

AP's Essen case involves no murders. Only rapes and assaults.

JM

[Ally]

Well Michael, while I find it incredible to believe that a case that involved police torture of an innocent damsel, police corruption and conspiracy and a rapist son of a high official wouldn't be readily available on the internet, without having to search "the archives" we'll have to wait and see what turns up.

Because whether he "combined" several cases or not, that would still be making things up and completely fabricating something that he attempts to hold forth as evidence.

[The Good Michael]

JM,

There is a chance that he combined several cases together, Kroll's being one of them. I can't find another rape/murder item in the Ruhr Valley, and that's searching in German too.

Cheers,

Mike

[jmenges]

After listening to the podcast and upon realizing that Colin Wilson wrote about this particular case, wouldn't it be bitterly ironic if AP had to rely upon a case described by Coilin Wilson for his arguments? No offense to AP, to be sure.

Mike

The Kroll case does appear in John Dunning's Arbor House Treasury of True Crime as the final chapter- Little Girl Stew. And guess who writes the introduction?

But Colin Wilson writes the introduction to everything.

JM

[jmenges]

There's no chance that AP's case is the Kroll murders.

AP's concerns assaults and rapes of students "in and around the university ground of Essen", not strangulation-rape-cannibalism of little girls and young women as in the case of Kroll. Kroll killed untold numbers of people, the police believe he could be responsible for at least 20 (including one male victim). He spread his crimes around a fairly large area, forty or fifty miles. There was only one known instance of Kroll murdering in the same town twice, that being his attacks in Bredney, which were separated by seven years.

JM

[Ally]

After being on the podcast, I have realized that AP is nothing if not flexible in his arguments and they are subject to change without warning. So I am sure he'd be happy to embrace Colin Wilson if it was necessary.

I think my favorite was him saying he thought Cutbush was Autistic then ten minutes later ( I mean ten and a half) when Cutbush was called Schizo, him saying he didn't like to apply modern terminology to his condition. If he can actually argue those two statements in one conversation, he can deal with any irony that comes his way.

[The Good Michael]

After listening to the podcast and upon realizing that Colin Wilson wrote about this particular case, wouldn't it be bitterly ironic if AP had to rely upon a case described by Coilin Wilson for his arguments? No offense to AP, to be sure.

Mike

[Ally]

Well yes, that's what's trying to be determined. AP stated that his entire belief that the MM was written to protect the nephew of Sup. Cutbush is based on this case, so it is kind of necessary to know if this case indeed existed.

[The Good Michael]

Ally,

That is AP's side, is it not? This story has Essen and Bochum connections as well. I would find it odd that two such things occured in roughly the same time period and in the same area, and involving mostly students.

I'll keep looking.

Mike

[Ally]

Hi, No Michael. The fact that the rapist is the son of a Bochum police detective and the police covered for him is central to the story. In fact it is the main ingredient.

[The Good Michael]

I think this must be the story http://www.magic.be/ClubMoral/DDV/Jockel/LongStory.html

Another site told me that Jockel had no father as he was imprisoned during WWII. He died in 1991.

Mike

[Natalie Severn]

That sounds fair , Ally .

[Ally]

I agree with Norma, there is absolutely no reason to feel guilty. There are only two possibilities here. Either the case exists exactly as AP reported it, and he will provide the details so that we can study this case, which is frankly fascinating with all the various twists and turns. Or the case doesn't exist, in which case, AP invented a story that has no basis in fact, which would hardly be the first time he'd done so, and you are hardly the one who should feel guilty about that.