Ripper Victim?

[Sam Flynn]

Hi Sam,

From the Echo 10 August 1888: "As soon as she was discovered the police had a photograph taken of her body, but the features were so distorted-possibly by an agonizing death-that some difficulty was at first experienced by her supposed friends in accurately recognizing her."

Thanks for that, Jon - never read that before, but it doesn't alter the fact that was certainly of the, erm, "well-nourished" disposition.

[Jon Guy]

Her face was fat,

Hi Sam,

From the Echo 10 August 1888:

no less than four persons, of different families, have come forward and positively identified the deceased, and are apparently ready to swear as to the accuracy of their assertions. The woman's features are rapidly changing from post-mortem appearances. As soon as she was discovered the police had a photograph taken of her body,but the features were so distorted-possibly by an agonizing death-that some difficulty was at first experienced by her supposed friends in accurately recognizing her.

We do, Gareth. I think I'll just provide a blast from the past rather than risk going round in circles of Toppy-esque diameters. http://forum.casebook.org/showthread...tabs#post69761 Best regards, Ben

You mean ever decreasing, until so miniscule that we realise we can't even see them (much like the infernal signatures) and we suddenly notice we're stuck on a couple of points? Hmm... And Toppy-esque? It's not even a real word! Tsk! Good job on the link though!

[Malcolm X]

Bon Soir mon ami,



How he got them lying down is a real mystery,...without noise apparently. For myself, I havent ruled out some anesthetic they wouldnt be able to detect as it was unknown to them.

Best regards David.

what i find odd is, why were his other victims older and much uglier than Kelly, Kelly is actually the odd one out !!!

maybe this means nothing

Hi Mike,
...
Slash... cut... It's all about knife... But it has been discussed so many times.
Anybody looking at Martha mortuary pic will observe that her face was swollen, and I'd say, much more swollen than Annie Chapman's, and indeed, a contemporary paper suggested suffocation.
That's something rather significant, not to talk about location, period, and victimology.
Et - oh!- j'allais oublier que le jour férié. Parce que je suis en train de bosser comme un âne.

Amitiés mon cher,
David

Bon Soir mon ami,

My untrained mind sees a great difference in the two David. The crimes that the Ripper has attributed to him with one exception are more tactile, more invasive...he handles the insides of those victims perhaps while their bodies still twitched. And using a knife to kill is effectively demonstrated in all 5 Canonical cases, and in Marthas case, the knife is abused as much as the victim, its a very inefficient way to kill someone and an obvious way to extend the duration of the kill itself. 39 stabs?

Although the exact methodology that Jack used to subdue his victims isnt clear, with Liz there likely was none...it was take charge and kill in one motion perhaps,..in Marys case he attacks with the knife....but nowhere is there evidence that he prolonged or etended the amount of time he would spend actually killing. The majority of time in most cases was spent cutting.

How he got them lying down is a real mystery,...without noise apparently. For myself, I havent ruled out some anesthetic they wouldnt be able to detect as it was unknown to them.

Best regards David.

[DVV]

Hi Sam,
her face could have been both fat and swollen.
The suggestion has been made, and suffocation may well explain the possible "silence" of the deed.
I wonder what Phillips would have said, had he conducted the post-mortem.

Amitiés mon cher,
David

[Sam Flynn]

Anybody looking at Martha mortuary pic will observe that her face was swollen

Her face was fat, Dave.

[Sam Flynn]

oh dont please, have you seen the size of that cut/stab thread

... almost as big as the gulf in scale and number of major stabs inflicted on Tabram and the (three) inconsequential jabs inflicted on only two of the canonical Ripper victims.

[DVV]

Hi Mike,
...
Slash... cut... It's all about knife... But it has been discussed so many times.
Anybody looking at Martha mortuary pic will observe that her face was swollen, and I'd say, much more swollen than Annie Chapman's, and indeed, a contemporary paper suggested suffocation.
That's something rather significant, not to talk about location, period, and victimology.
Et - oh!- j'allais oublier que le jour férié. Parce que je suis en train de bosser comme un âne.

Amitiés mon cher,
David

[Malcolm X]

oh dont please, have you seen the size of that cut/stab thread

We do, Gareth.

I think I'll just provide a blast from the past rather than risk going round in circles of Toppy-esque diameters.

Best regards,
Ben

I thought "risk going round in circles" was a priceless comment on a 141 page thread.

I agree with you Ben that Jack stabbed on occasion, but never as the means by which to kill someone.

Best regards Ben

[Ben]

We do, Gareth.

I think I'll just provide a blast from the past rather than risk going round in circles of Toppy-esque diameters.

http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?p=69761&highlight=stabs#post69761

Best regards,
Ben

[Sam Flynn]

Trouble is, it's even more ridiculous to argue that a serial killer who slashes/cuts can't also have stabbed, especially when we know this one did both.

We do, Ben?

[Ben]

At the same time it is ridiculos to say that stabbing and slashing/cutting are one and the same

Oh, totally.

Trouble is, it's even more ridiculous to argue that a serial killer who slashes/cuts can't also have stabbed, especially when we know this one did both.

All the best,
Ben

[Malcolm X]

yes, the TABRAM murder doesn't have the traits of the ripper at all, it's a frenzied knife attack, with another larger weapon being used to finish her off, it looks like two killers................Alice Mckenzie yes, that looks like a ripper murder but definitely not TABRAM...

a ripper first kill would indeed resemble a Mckenzie, you'd see similar traits but from a first timer..an amateur, but TABRAM looks like a couple of street yobs.