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Mary Jane Kelly found?

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  • On the subject of Barnett's identification, I think it sound. He insisted that he could identify the victim as Kelly and he said why that was the case. Lighting is not an issue for me. (I could identify my wife just by looking at her toes.)

    If the object of the mutilation had been to conceal the identity of the victim it would surely have been easier - and quicker - to set fire to the bed?
    "It is a capital mistake to theorise before one has data. Insensibly one begins twisting facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (as Sherlock Holmes).

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    • Originally posted by Bridewell View Post
      On the subject of Barnett's identification, I think it sound. He insisted that he could identify the victim as Kelly and he said why that was the case. Lighting is not an issue for me. (I could identify my wife just by looking at her toes.)

      If the object of the mutilation had been to conceal the identity of the victim it would surely have been easier - and quicker - to set fire to the bed?
      Setting fire to the bed would mean a lot of attention dream to the murder scene very quickly. The murder would be discovered very quickly and the smoke and flames could be noticed as the ripper exits. The mutilations allowed the ripper a large gap between leaving and discovery

      The Maxwell and Lewis sighting make me wonder if the murder actually too place shortly before the discovery. However the screams would indicate otherwise. So much conflicting evidence!!!

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      • Originally posted by Bridewell View Post
        On the subject of Barnett's identification, I think it sound. He insisted that he could identify the victim as Kelly and he said why that was the case. Lighting is not an issue for me. (I could identify my wife just by looking at her toes.)

        If the object of the mutilation had been to conceal the identity of the victim it would surely have been easier - and quicker - to set fire to the bed?
        I could ID my wife by her toes too. I suspect I could identify her by the nail of her little toe.
        G U T

        There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

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        • Originally posted by RockySullivan View Post
          Setting fire to the bed would mean a lot of attention dream to the murder scene very quickly. The murder would be discovered very quickly and the smoke and flames could be noticed as the ripper exits. The mutilations allowed the ripper a large gap between leaving and discovery

          The Maxwell and Lewis sighting make me wonder if the murder actually too place shortly before the discovery. However the screams would indicate otherwise. So much conflicting evidence!!!
          What screams?

          The simewhat muffled cry if murder, a cry that from some reports was pretty common aroun the East End.
          G U T

          There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Debra A View Post
            There is another article in the Welsh papers database that may be of interest but it is in Welsh, also.
            It has something to do with a death of a woman relative of Edward Davies of Aberangell and John Weston Davies of Gloucester.

            http://newspapers.library.wales/view...16/3193219/21/
            She was Edward Davies' daughter, Debs, and John Weston Davies' sister. I haven't got time to translate the article now, but - if I remember! - I'll do so tomorrow evening.
            Kind regards, Sam Flynn

            "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

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            • Originally posted by GUT View Post
              I could ID my wife by her toes too. I suspect I could identify her by the nail of her little toe.
              Too much information
              Kind regards, Sam Flynn

              "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                She was Edward Davies' daughter, Debs, and John Weston Davies' sister. I haven't got time to translate the article now, but - if I remember! - I'll do so tomorrow evening.
                Thank you, Gareth. I had an inklng it was a sister...but which one?! Elizabeth was the daughter of Edward and sister of John Weston..One other died young and the article mentions three daughters....is it Matilda, Hannah or Elizabeth?

                duff duff duff duff duff duff
                Last edited by Debra A; 08-27-2015, 02:38 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Debra A View Post
                  Thank you, Gareth. I had an inklng it was a sister...but which one?! Elizabeth was the daughter of Edward and sister of John Weston..One other died young and the article mentions three daughters....is it Matilda, Hannah or Elizabeth?
                  The article is an obit for a "Mrs D S Price", no full name given, but her husband is named as "Mr D L Price". Don't know if that helps - I doubt it, given that none of the daughters you mention had the initials "D S"
                  Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                  "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                    Too much information
                    I just find it strange that people doubt Joe could ID Mary by her eyes, or ear or hair.

                    I know I could ID My wife by her nose, or her eyes or yes her hair (I suspect hers and Mary's were a similar color). The scar on her left knee I would know anywhere.

                    I had an uncle who had a leg removed, after the surgery the leg was taken away under a cover, on a tray, the sole was visible his little girl, then about 4 years old said, hey nanna there's daddy's foot, she could see he sole of his foot, but had no doubt it was daddy's. (the staff should have been shot for taking it past the family but that's another issue).
                    G U T

                    There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by GUT View Post
                      I could ID my wife by her toes too. I suspect I could identify her by the nail of her little toe.
                      There is a supposedly true story of two senators walking down the hall in the U.S. Senate. The one senator was bald on top. The other senator reached out and rubbed the top of the bald senator's head and said "you know, the top of your head feels just like my wife's butt." The bald senator immediately reached up to rub his own head and replied "hey you're right, it does."

                      c.d.

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                      • In addition to the body, there was also the chemise she was wearing. It is quite possible that Barnett was familiar with that as well.

                        c.d.

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                        • We know that Abberline investigated the pipe found in the room and established that it was Barnett's. I dare say he asked Barnett about any clothes found in the room and, perhaps more importantly, the other women in the Court.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                            The article is an obit for a "Mrs D S Price", no full name given, but her husband is named as "Mr D L Price". Don't know if that helps - I doubt it, given that none of the daughters you mention had the initials "D S"
                            From the article:

                            "The two sons, Messrs Edward Davies, Aberangell, and John Weston Davies, Gloucester, are staying to mourn after her. The only surviving daughter is the widow of the late Rev Griffith Hughes. She was in the Khassia Hills with her husband for ten years, and came to Rhos to attend to her sister in her last hours."
                            Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                            "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

                            Comment


                            • Thank you Gareth.

                              EWD's brother JWD was living in Wigan in 1911.

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                              • Elizabeth Davies

                                I was thinking about why Mr Weston-Davies father was so reluctant to talk about Elizabeth.
                                I do hope Mr West Davies does not mind my trawling his genealogy. I came up with a few possibilities.
                                She obviously met a bad end or done something bad to affect him so.
                                I found a few possibles that could fit.
                                Around 1906 a John Birmingham was charged with murdering his common law wife Elizabeth Davies. He lived in Wedmore street Upper Holloway and was a general dealer.
                                In Cannes France an Elizabeth Davies dropped a candle on herself and burnt to death (however this was a later date which I cant remember) They were on FMP newspaper search if anyone wants to look.
                                I can understand Mr Weston Davies puzzlement at this ladys life as it does seem strange. More so the fact that she married as Jones. I am sure I found one of her sisters in Talyllin married to a Mr Jones he was a Quarryworker.
                                I will try to locate it.
                                Pat.......

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