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My attempt to decipher the MJK in situ photograph

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  • Henry Flower
    replied
    Bond explicitly states that her cheeks were at least partially severed, which makes it entirely possible that large flaps of flesh are obscuring her right eye, and that the more accessible outer edge of her zygomatic (lower outer eye socket and cheekbone) could be left partly denuded of flesh.

    I also think Columbo's earlier observation is doubtless correct, that gouges or hanging flesh has entirely distorted her jawline. It has always just looked plain wrong anatomically.

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  • Henry Flower
    replied
    Originally posted by Karl View Post
    We could be looking at the edges of the left eye socket, though. It looks like the sort of rounded corner that the eye socket has, and it is not too far to the side for the eye socket. But I am not sure at all. We are, after all, trying to discern patterns in a mangled, shapeless mass. The only thing we can say for certain is that it's the face.
    Karl, I had to study anatomy extensively at a New York art school a few years back, and last night I took a human skull down from the bookcase and positioned it side by side with the image of MJK's head, same position and angle as far as I could discern, and I was immediately struck by the fact that - as you suggest - we do appear to be able to see a portion of her zygomatic bone, the inferior lateral edge of her orbital cavity, or in layman's terms, the lower outside corner of her left eye socket. This tends I think to confirm the locations of what I took to be her lips and severed nose.

    As to what is happening on the right side of her face, there is nothing recognisable, and it can only be that flaps or fragments of hacked flesh have obscured her entire eye region. We really are reduced to complete guesswork there.

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  • Karl
    replied
    Originally posted by Columbo View Post
    Such a gruesome pic. If we're correct and that is Mary's right eye, then it's my opinion he must've cut at least a good size of the right side of the face and folded over to the left. There is no discernible feature on the left side. It looks like her left eye and check are covered. I don't know, I'm starting to doubt that is the left eye now. it looks a little far out towards the side of the head.

    Columbo
    We could be looking at the edges of the left eye socket, though. It looks like the sort of rounded corner that the eye socket has, and it is not too far to the side for the eye socket. But I am not sure at all. We are, after all, trying to discern patterns in a mangled, shapeless mass. The only thing we can say for certain is that it's the face.
    Last edited by Karl; 06-22-2016, 01:02 AM.

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  • Columbo
    replied
    Originally posted by Robert St Devil View Post
    Henry Flower

    I roughed out the shape of an eye and a flap of skin hanging off of her forehead based off her picture in your post #94.
    Such a gruesome pic. If we're correct and that is Mary's right eye, then it's my opinion he must've cut at least a good size of the right side of the face and folded over to the left. There is no discernible feature on the left side. It looks like her left eye and check are covered. I don't know, I'm starting to doubt that is the left eye now. it looks a little far out towards the side of the head.

    Columbo

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  • Robert St Devil
    replied
    Henry Flower

    I roughed out the shape of an eye and a flap of skin hanging off of her forehead based off her picture in your post #94.
    Attached Files

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  • Henry Flower
    replied
    I agree. I can't think of another explanation. I think nose stump, blanched and sliced lips, and her left eye region are all broadly discernable, and a hanging flap is the only explanation for the absence of a right eye. The shadowy patch that Pierre, among others, has identified as being her right eye is in way the wrong position.

    Looks like Pierre has misinterpreted the source.

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  • Robert St Devil
    replied
    Originally posted by Columbo View Post
    I think the left circle is correct. the right is covered up by hanging skin (I think).

    Columbo

    I see that too Columbo, but only in the picture in post 94. If you amplify it, it looks like a flap of skin is hanging off her forehead and covering her right eye. In that picture, you could draw out the shape of an eye and the circle of her eyeball.

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  • Columbo
    replied
    Originally posted by Pierre View Post
    Are these the eyes (in the blue circles)?

    Regards, Pierre
    I think the left circle is correct. the right is covered up by hanging skin (I think).

    Columbo

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  • Columbo
    replied
    Originally posted by Henry Flower View Post
    I more or less agree. After all:

    "the face hacked beyond recognition of the features."

    and:

    "The face was gashed in all directions the nose cheeks, eyebrows and ears being partly removed. The lips were blanched & cut by several incisions running obliquely down to the chin. There were also numerous cuts extending irregularly across all the features."

    It's a shame Bond does not mention the eyes, I'd love to know where you think you can see them. The only features I think I can maybe locate are her lips (thanks to Bond we know they were not removed) with some cuts through them, and above the lips a darker vaguely triangular area that may be the remains of her severed nose. I even think we can discern two darker areas within that triangle that may represent the remains of her nasal cavities.

    But I may be wrong.
    Hi Henry,
    The impression I get is the right eye is at the top upper center, about where you would expect it. Although I haven't spent anytime at all studying this pic to the degree others have, I've always thought the jawline was an illusion. I think the shape of the jaw is really hanging skin that is distorting the overall shape of Mary's face. I think that causes people to misplace other parts of her face. Just my opinion.

    Columbo

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  • Geddy2112
    replied
    Obviously you would have to look at the previous picture as I've drawn on it but to me (and it makes no difference what so ever in my eyes) I can make out some teeth and bottom lip.... perhaps, possibly... who cares
    Attached Files

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  • Karl
    replied
    Originally posted by Pierre View Post
    Are these the eyes (in the blue circles)?

    Regards, Pierre
    They're pretty far apart, then. The left circle (ie. her left) is in the right place if her head is turned 90 degrees towards the camera, but not the other one. Her head could be turned somewhat less than 90 degrees, though, in which case the right (her right) circle is in the correct place for her right eye - but then the other circle is off.

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  • Pierre
    replied
    Originally posted by Karl View Post
    The eyes are an interesting detail to me, because they were said to have been left intact - and yet I cannot for the life of me find them in the photo. Why is the face such a blurry mess when other details are comparatively sharp?
    Are these the eyes (in the blue circles)?

    Regards, Pierre
    Attached Files

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  • Karl
    replied
    The eyes are an interesting detail to me, because they were said to have been left intact - and yet I cannot for the life of me find them in the photo. Why is the face such a blurry mess when other details are comparatively sharp?

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  • Henry Flower
    replied
    I'm also amazed, judging purely by the photo, that there is room under that head for a uterus, kidneys (plural), and one breast.

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  • Henry Flower
    replied
    Originally posted by Columbo View Post
    There is no way to determine any facial features in that picture except for the eyes.
    I think when people see things in this picture it's because they want to...
    There is NO way anyone can look at any copy of this pic and find lips, eyelids, eyebrows, a nose etc. I've seen people on this site try to re-construct her face based on this pic and it's an act of futility.
    I more or less agree. After all:

    "the face hacked beyond recognition of the features."

    and:

    "The face was gashed in all directions the nose cheeks, eyebrows and ears being partly removed. The lips were blanched & cut by several incisions running obliquely down to the chin. There were also numerous cuts extending irregularly across all the features."

    It's a shame Bond does not mention the eyes, I'd love to know where you think you can see them. The only features I think I can maybe locate are her lips (thanks to Bond we know they were not removed) with some cuts through them, and above the lips a darker vaguely triangular area that may be the remains of her severed nose. I even think we can discern two darker areas within that triangle that may represent the remains of her nasal cavities.

    But I may be wrong.
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:

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