Murder, what murder?

[Natasha]

Hello Natasha. Thanks.

If it were an exhumed body, surely such would have been detected at autopsy?

Cheers.
LC

Hi lynn

I don’t have a difinative anwser to this, but the Bond autopsy report was lost then it turned up again, maybe someone had tampered with the report. Its worth noting that is is quite sparse in places regarding the evalution of the body compared to the other murders and considering that MJK murder took place inside and the police and coroners etc had a long time to examine the body in those circumstances you would expect more information to be added to this report, maybe even more so then the others.

[packers stem]

Hi Natasha,don't let the banter put you off your research.Very little changes on here and any suggestions that hint at any sort of motive are likely to produce a few cackles but it's all good natured.......usually
I posted a lot along similar lines to your thinking a few years ago and it's far too much to go repeating in full but most of it was on the thread 'maxwell' ,i'll try in a minute to remember how to put a link on lol.

All the best

[Natasha]

And there was I doing my damnedest to keep the royals, the masons and bleedin' Burke and Hare out of it...

Hi Mr B



I know you are not a fan of this theory, but truth is stranger then fiction!

[MrBarnett]

You're all mad!

And there was I doing my damnedest to keep the royals, the masons and bleedin' Burke and Hare out of it...

[Observer]

You're all mad!

[Hatchett]

Hi,

Forgive me, but I think the theory is now getting a little pedestrian.

But if we are going on that line, it is rather noticeable that the face and body of Mary Kelly was rendered unrecorgnisable, except for the eyes and ears ....
And just a point on that. With Barnet being a local working class London guy, it is highly probable that he did not say his "H's" so infact, what he could have said was that he recognised her by her "Eyes and air," meaning her "eyes and hair."

Best wishes.

[MrBarnett]

As Lynn suggests, unless the medics are part of the conspiracy it would have to be a very fresh corpse. And as Penhalion points out, there would have to some kind of existential threat to the establishment or to an individual to warrant such an elaborate and gruesome hoax.

Of course, this needn't be some grand, pre-planned establishment conspiracy. What if a prostitute pal of Mary's was killed by McCarthy, say, angry that his premises were being used as a brothel or, conversely, that he was being stiffed of his cut of the takings.

The crime scene is then set to make it look like a ripper killing, Mary is packed off to the hat shop in Harrogate and the next day an unwitting Indian Harry is sent round to Kelly's to ask for the rent.

MrB

[lynn cates]

autopsy

Hello Natasha. Thanks.

If it were an exhumed body, surely such would have been detected at autopsy?

Cheers.
LC

[Penhalion]

If she WASN'T a near homeless, 4 pence-a-shag prostitute, then she was hardcore undercover. Or was Joe Barnett in on it too?

Admittedly, the inability to find any record of her before she appeared in Whitechapel is a significant problem, but I'm not entirely sure we can extrapolate from that to a vastly different life than she reported.

[Hatchett]

Hi,

Can I join in?

Of course, considering that no one has gotten very far in tracing the background of Kelly, it could be that she wasnt of the class that is assumed.
The working class prostitute could have been a false identity.

At the time there were the Fenian threats. Also 1888 was a time of tremendous social change and social out rage.

There were all sorts of nationalities living in Whitechapel at the time, coming from parts of the world that were all going through explosive times, and power struggles that would eventually lead up to the First World War.

In times of severe unrest, hysterical things happen.

So who knows?

[Harry D]

Wait, wait, wait. I'm confused about the theory.

So the cops knew that internal affairs were setting them up?

[Natasha]

Hello Natasha. Interesting theory.

For this to work, it seems that a cadaver must have been sent in and mutilated. But, forensically, the blood splashes, etc. seem to have come from a body killed and mutilated on site.

The other alternative is that a dupe was selected and killed/mutilated. And I think the Met and even SB would be forbidden by law so to do. (heh-heh)

Perhaps this theory could be emended?

Cheers.
LC

Hi Lynn

It doesn’t necessarily have had to be the police that staged the murder scene. What if Kelly wanted to kill off her identity and asked someone for their assistance, maybe because of the man she was scared of, or something else?

There appears be a longer time period for this murder compared to the other murders, could that be because they were waiting for a possible match for their plan to work? It might be useful to research obituaries etc.

Now the question about grave robbing. Why would it not be possible to obtain a body from the cemetery unseen? After all the ripper was operating right under the nose of the police. Part of the reason that made me think of this theory was Burke & Hare.

Does anyone have any idea how the letter to Norfolk (if it was relevant to the 'murder') would fit into this?

The picture of Kelly is quite grainy as we cannot see it properly, we can not ascertain weather the splashes are consistent with a murder having taken place at Millers Court. Animal blood could have been used, after all the coroner etc had no way of distinguishing animal from human blood, and their forensic techniques were not as advanced as today.

[MrBarnett]

Oh, I almost forgot the lookout. You'd need someone lurking about in Dorset Street to ensure you weren't interrupted.

And Mary would be have to be set up with a nice little hat shop in Harrogate and told to keep shtum.

Still a work in progress, obviously, but if we get a move on, it could be in the shops by Christmas.

MrB

[MrBarnett]

What if the party at risk was a little higher up the social scale than a mere 'gentleman'? So high in fact that a threat to him was a threat to the entire establishment. He may have had some socially unacceptable tastes which brought him into contact with an individual who was not well disposed to the British establishment.

And perhaps the potential threat from that individual was not so easy to neutralise. He may have been a foreign national, perhaps he was an outspoken supporter of Fenianism, who couldn't just be locked up or bumped off without causing political waves.

A reasonably fresh cadaver, a little additional pigs blood to set the scene, oh and a mickey finn administered to the troublemaker, and 'problem solved'.


MrB

[c.d.]

Work the number 39 into this theory and I think we have a winner.

c.d.