How close have people gotten

[Wickerman]

You mean "Julia"? She never came forward, am I right?

Well, most think this Julia was Maria Harvey. It's just that Harvey claimed to have stayed with Mary on the previous Monday & Tuesday, but this woman referred to as 'Julia' by Barnett he claimed shared the room with him & Kelly in the nights previous to him leaving, which was on 30th Oct.
So, thats a bit of confusion.
Likewise, Harvey claims to have been with Joe & Mary on Thursday 8th Nov., but at the inquest Barnett didn't identify the women as Harvey, yet they knew each other & were in the same court.

So, is it really confirmed that Harvey was 'Julia'?
Both claimed to have left two shirts in the room.

[DJA]

There are at least three versions.

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

In his police statement Barnett told Abberline that she had resorted to prostitution to make ends meet, because he failed to provide enough money. Then she took a woman in who was also a prostitute, so he left.

So, I ask, why do we not hear from that woman?

You mean "Julia"? She never came forward, am I right?

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

So,why did Barnett leave?

I guess it must have been hard for him to share that cramped little room with other unfortunates. He and Mary had no privacy left.

[Wickerman]

In his police statement Barnett told Abberline that she had resorted to prostitution to make ends meet, because he failed to provide enough money. Then she took a woman in who was also a prostitute, so he left.

So, I ask, why do we not hear from that woman?

[DJA]

So,why did Barnett leave?

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

Hi MJD. You may become aware that some posters like to use nudge nudge wink wink to a blind bat kind of postings.
Let me posit what might be implied: doubtless I will stand corrected if I am wrong.

Yes gay didn't mean what it does today. But homosexuality was ignored unless it became explicit and could not be ignored, as in Wilde, when such an allegation let alone proof would ruin a professional career, and bar a man from polite society. Gay men tended to marry women who accepted their leaning. (Today some call them "beards", as in false beards.)

So, maybe Barnett was gay and Mary his alibi. Maybe this is how she learned that Sutton was gay, if he was. Maybe Barnett and Sutton both attended Cleveland Street parties. Maybe that is why she was blackmailing Sutton, if she did, who maybe turned into the Ripper, if he did. Sutton had boundless medical ability, access to long thin blades, worked alongside Whitechapel, and maybe had all the canonical five as patients. As a candidate: better than Sickert. What I have never understood is why the canonical five wouldn't beggar off once the first two had been done in. Shades of the Sherlock Holmes story about the five pips, and Agatha Christie's novel which cannot be named.

HTH
Dupin

Hi Dupin!
This is some Conspiracy Theory stuff, huh? I know you're ironic. I don't think that Sutton was the Ripper. Actually, I'm not sure the latter had any specific anatomical knowledge or surgical training. As far as homosexuality is concerned, it was quite a taboo back then. Gay men were sentenced to prison time. Gays and lesbians were closeted. So I doubt that Mary was into women and slept with them, while Barnett acted as a "beard". According to me, she truly was a kind-hearted, compassionate woman who let her homeless friends share her tiny room with her. The alternative to this scenario is that she charged them with money in exchange for a place to sleep in, but then she would have had some money to pay her arrears, unless she drank them.

[Dupin]

Hi MJD. You may become aware that some posters like to use nudge nudge wink wink to a blind bat kind of postings.
Let me posit what might be implied: doubtless I will stand corrected if I am wrong.

Yes gay didn't mean what it does today. But homosexuality was ignored unless it became explicit and could not be ignored, as in Wilde, when such an allegation let alone proof would ruin a professional career, and bar a man from polite society. Gay men tended to marry women who accepted their leaning. (Today some call them "beards", as in false beards.)

So, maybe Barnett was gay and Mary his alibi. Maybe this is how she learned that Sutton was gay, if he was. Maybe Barnett and Sutton both attended Cleveland Street parties. Maybe that is why she was blackmailing Sutton, if she did, who maybe turned into the Ripper, if he did. Sutton had boundless medical ability, access to long thin blades, worked alongside Whitechapel, and maybe had all the canonical five as patients. As a candidate: better than Sickert. What I have never understood is why the canonical five wouldn't beggar off once the first two had been done in. Shades of the Sherlock Holmes story about the five pips, and Agatha Christie's novel which cannot be named.

HTH
Dupin

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

Reckon he was infatuated with her but not sharing the bed.

He left because she was sleeping with another woman.

Remember Mary worked at a GAY House in the West End.

I don't share your view, DJA, but obviously I respect it. I think that the term "gay house" referred to a brothel.

[DJA]

What do you mean? Do you think that Barnett was her pimp?

Reckon he was infatuated with her but not sharing the bed.

He left because she was sleeping with another woman.

Remember Mary worked at a GAY House in the West End.

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

I've long suspected that Barnett's relationship with Mary Ann Kelly was not what we surmise.

What do you mean? Do you think that Barnett was her pimp?

[DJA]

Yes, Mrs. Phoenix definitely knew her through the Morgensterns, but I don't understand why Barnett, her partner of eighteen months, didn't mention that particular feature. Or Mrs. Prater, for that matter. Do you think it's possible that Phoenix made it up out of jealousy?

I've long suspected that Barnett's relationship with Mary Ann Kelly was not what we surmise.

[DJA]

Her lips are at the bottom left of her head.
The two teeth are easy to spot.

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

The high definition blowup of MJK2 does show two teeth that are likely to be false teeth.

Hi DJA!
Can you point them to me, please? I'm afraid I can't spot them.

[Marie Jeanette Davies]

The problem is, the Catholic church won't allow her remains to be searched for. I'm Italian and unfortunately I know a thing or two about Catholicism, being a lapsed Catholic myself. Catholics believe that the dead mustn't be "disturbed" and their remains disinterred.