Exhumation of Kelly....any updates?

[GUT]

I've excerpted 9 minutes from our conversation with Wynne Weston Davies so you can hear his thoughts on the matter as they were at the time of the publication of his book in August of 2015. On the full episode, this section begins at the 1:14:30 mark of the 2 hour long interview.

www.rippercast.com/mp3/WWD on exhumation.mp3

JM

Thanks Jon,

[jmenges]

I've excerpted 9 minutes from our conversation with Wynne Weston Davies so you can hear his thoughts on the matter as they were at the time of the publication of his book in August of 2015. On the full episode, this section begins at the 1:14:30 mark of the 2 hour long interview.

www.rippercast.com/mp3/WWD on exhumation.mp3

JM

[AuroraSarintacos]

The little amount of evidence offered suggests that she was just an ordinary woman living in dire and desperate circumstances. All basis on her character can only be speculated upon and I'm under the impression that she wasn't a very likable individual.

I believe a lot of the various myths surrounding Ms. Kelly tie back to the misleading press reports of the time. She seems to have been glamorized early on in the press reports of the time as they capitulate upon her supposed youth and good looks; it sold Newspapers.

Personally, going off of the witness descriptions, as well as the portraits that we have of her which do not portray a comely looking woman, even though none of that matters, but I do speculate that is one of the many reasons why she's also so highly focused on.

My opinion is she was in London for the majority of her life and she lied about her past. She was possibly in her 30's and rather dowdy.

I think her friends described her in flattering terms given the situation.

[GUT]

What is with the romanticism of this poor dead woman?

This would unfortunately never come into fruition due to the large amount of legal issues and procedures one would run into.

It seems almost every year a new theory on the identity of Jack the Ripper is published - this also seems to be the case with Ms. Kelly.

What I find the most intriguing is that that Mr. Davies's claim, as others in the past, that Kelly is actually his distant relative, yet there is absolutely no proof to support these claims and much of it, I speculate, is fabrication. My only question is why? Why make claims you know for an ascertained fact that you can not support?

We'll never know who Kelly was. She died a terrible death and lived a horrible life.

Even in death she can't rest peacefully.

From the day I heard it I said the legal issues would be insurmountable, and I think he knew it all along.

[Michael W Richards]

What is with the romanticism of this poor dead woman?

This would unfortunately never come into fruition due to the large amount of legal issues and procedures one would run into.

It seems almost every year a new theory on the identity of Jack the Ripper is published - this also seems to be the case with Ms. Kelly.

What I find the most intriguing is that that Mr. Davies's claim, as others in the past, that Kelly is actually his distant relative, yet there is absolutely no proof to support these claims and much of it, I speculate, is fabrication. My only question is why? Why make claims you know for an ascertained fact that you can not support?

We'll never know who Kelly was. She died a terrible death and lived a horrible life.

Even in death she can't rest peacefully.

Its one of the problems with the study Aurora, in many cases there is likely no reason to drag the histories and rumors of some of these women through the mud. Each new book proposes theories that are without any empirical proof, and that inevitably shed light on these murdered women once again, suggesting their connection to heinous crimes and nefarious individuals. I remember seeing a show rebroadcast recently and one of Polly Nichols relatives reaction when she was contacted by a Ripperolgist, (my apologies but I have forgotten who hosted the special...but I do recall I knew the name), and learned not only the details of her life and death, but also I think the extent to which people have been examining her records and reading so-called truths about her.

I personally do not believe that exhumation of anyones remains should be done unless it is to match DNA. Its one reason I plan to be buried in an ashtray.

[c.d.]

I was under the impression that he did get permission. Is that correct?

c.d.

[AuroraSarintacos]

What is with the romanticism of this poor dead woman?

This would unfortunately never come into fruition due to the large amount of legal issues and procedures one would run into.

It seems almost every year a new theory on the identity of Jack the Ripper is published - this also seems to be the case with Ms. Kelly.

What I find the most intriguing is that that Mr. Davies's claim, as others in the past, that Kelly is actually his distant relative, yet there is absolutely no proof to support these claims and much of it, I speculate, is fabrication. My only question is why? Why make claims you know for an ascertained fact that you can not support?

We'll never know who Kelly was. She died a terrible death and lived a horrible life.

Even in death she can't rest peacefully.

[Debra A]

That's my point, Debs. At the time WWD was publicising his book he must already have known, or at least suspected, the difficulties involved. Not just the cost, but the likelihood that the authorities and/or the descendants of the others buried in that area would prevent the exhumation from going ahead. And why would they? What kind of a precedent would it have set? This is not a Richard III scenario, it's just one among hundreds of Ripper theories with little or no concrete facts to support it.

Yes, I agree.

[MrBarnett]

The final study and report from the University of Leicester was done for Patricia Cornwell. I seem to recall that Wynn Weston Davies admitted he didn't have the funds to pursue it fully at the time his book came out and said he had been approached by other parties. I think a TV company was mentioned.

That's my point, Debs. At the time WWD was publicising his book he must already have known, or at least suspected, the difficulties involved. Not just the cost, but the likelihood that the authorities and/or the descendants of the others buried in that area would prevent the exhumation from going ahead. And why would they? What kind of a precedent would it have set? This is not a Richard III scenario, it's just one among hundreds of Ripper theories with little or no concrete facts to support it.

[Busy Beaver]

Has anyone made contact with members of the Barnett family, if they are still around? Perhaps they still hold the key to the true identity of Mary Jane Kelly.

[Debra A]

It ain't gonna happen, though, and I suspect WWD may have known that all along.

The final study and report from the University of Leicester was done for Patricia Cornwell. I seem to recall that Wynn Weston Davies admitted he didn't have the funds to pursue it fully at the time his book came out and said he had been approached by other parties. I think a TV company was mentioned.

[MrBarnett]

I have relatives lying in 'pauper's' graves in that cemetery. No idea whether they lie in the area under consideration, though.

Would I be happy for them to dig up great grandad (etc)'s bones to satisfy the morbid curiosity of WWD and Ms Cornwell?

Perhaps, if they paid for all the remains to be identified and reburied in individual graves with nice headstones...

It ain't gonna happen, though, and I suspect WWD may have known that all along.

[MrBarnett]

Slightly off-topic but it was interesting to see that Leicester University's press release write-up about what is known about Mary Jane Kelly reads:

"Indeed, the lack of known records for her[Mary Jane Kelly]- no birth certificate or marriage certificate, no trace in the censuses of the 186s, 70s or 80s, no photographs, nor evidence of family or reputed husband, truly no trace of her at all before she arrived in London – is in stark contrast to the other four victims of the ripper, who are all well documented,..."

my bolding

Well? All?

[Debra A]

Slightly off-topic but it was interesting to see that Leicester University's press release write-up about what is known about Mary Jane Kelly reads:

"Indeed, the lack of known records for her[Mary Jane Kelly]- no birth certificate or marriage certificate, no trace in the censuses of the 186s, 70s or 80s, no photographs, nor evidence of family or reputed husband, truly no trace of her at all before she arrived in London – is in stark contrast to the other four victims of the ripper, who are all well documented,..."

my bolding

[Debra A]

https://www2.le.ac.uk/offices/press/...ary-jane-kelly