Mortuary Photographs

[Rob Clack]

The photos we have of Tabram, Nichols, Chapman, Stride, McKenzie and Coles were taken for identification purposes, so there may be others showing there injuries. There was a photograph taken of Rose Mylett so there may be one of her still out there. Also probably of the Pinchin Street Torso. With Mary Kelly there may have been photographs taken after her post-mortem like there was for Catherine Eddowes.

Rob

[Mayerling]

Cheers Robert I'll paste the interesting bit if you dont mind:

An intriguing footnote to all this was that on meeting Eric Barton at his home I found it to be a veritable "Aladdin's Cave." In telling the story of his purchase, Eric revealed that also with Sims' letters was a full set of the crime scene photos of Miller's Court and Mary Jane Kelly! He had never sold them and they were still in his home somewhere. I kept in contact with Eric hoping that he would find these photos which he said I could have. Unfortunately Eric died before the photographs were located. (It will be remembered that Sims was a friend of Macnaghten and it is from him that Sims undoubtedly obtained the photos).

Clearly Stewart believed that other photos existed. And from what is said it would appear probable.

Having spoken to a number of people I personally believe much still lays out there somewhere to be discovered..

Which is why I have always beleived a national crime museum would give a good focus for people to leave photos etc..

dont forgat that somewhere out there..still exists the original 'Lusk' letter and its DNA...not sealed in laminate hopefully.

Lots to discover.

Thanks Robert

Jeff

Hi Jeff,

I like your idea of a National Crime Museum for Britain. Perhaps a lot of material would come out of the closet, so to speak.

Years ago I was using (for a non-Ripper article) FAMOUS CRIMES, that early 20th Century magazine. It had small subcolumns that dealt with odd bits about famous crimes, but also had letters from the readers. The authors of the letters were not revealed (the editor only put out their initials) and the letters were not fully printed. Quite a number turned out to be descendants of criminals. That magazine was published from 1901 to 1905.

One can imagine how much material on all criminal cases has been lost since then. It's true in every country. Two years back I read a book about the
Ruth Snyder - Judd Gray Case of 1927, and the author (who did a wonderful
job to be as complete as possible) admitted that much was thrown out over the years by the police - including transcripts of their interrogations of Ruth and Judd. And that was in my native Queens.

I have to admit that I agree with Phil about the horror a rediscovered photo of Mary Kelly's body in the morgue would bring. I have difficulties looking at the two photos of her body in the little room she died in. To me they remain the all-time worst attrocity pictures I have seen from peace time. I suspect some pictures from wartime (particularly of Nazi attrocities) would turn my stomach too.

However, anything can be rediscovered. Last week archeologists announced they found the location of George Washington's boyhood home in Virginia, and were preparing to establish the perameters of it with the intention of rebuilding it. If they could find Washington's birthplace, they can find other pictures and documents from the Ripper Case.

Personally I would still want to see the morgue photo of the dead Montague Druitt more than a "reconstructed" facial photo of Mary Kelly.

Best wishes,

Jeff

There may indeed be a photo or two we might still see, but Im dubious as to whether it would add anything investigatorially...unless previously unknown information was visible in them.

Personally I think a photo after they had performed their "Volte Face", or reconstruction, would be more shocking than the room shots. In those, there are human features within an indistinct bloody mass, or mess,....but to see a human with the patchwork that would be needed...

I hope they dont find one like that, but I am morbidly curious as to what could have be done with her face.

Best regards

[Dan Norder]

Stewart posted many more details about this on these very boards not too long ago. I'm surprised people missed it. You can start with this post and read through the thread for additional information.

[Jeff Leahy]

It's here.

http://www.casebook.org/authors/inte...t_evans.2.html

Cheers Robert I'll paste the interesting bit if you dont mind:

An intriguing footnote to all this was that on meeting Eric Barton at his home I found it to be a veritable "Aladdin's Cave." In telling the story of his purchase, Eric revealed that also with Sims' letters was a full set of the crime scene photos of Miller's Court and Mary Jane Kelly! He had never sold them and they were still in his home somewhere. I kept in contact with Eric hoping that he would find these photos which he said I could have. Unfortunately Eric died before the photographs were located. (It will be remembered that Sims was a friend of Macnaghten and it is from him that Sims undoubtedly obtained the photos).

Clearly Stewart believed that other photos existed. And from what is said it would appear probable.

Having spoken to a number of people I personally believe much still lays out there somewhere to be discovered..

Which is why I have always beleived a national crime museum would give a good focus for people to leave photos etc..

dont forgat that somewhere out there..still exists the original 'Lusk' letter and its DNA...not sealed in laminate hopefully.

Lots to discover.

Thanks Robert

Jeff

[Jeff Leahy]

Hello Sam!

You mean, that there is "FM" on her face too?!

My God, a new clue; in that case Jack was a dis... das... dyslexic!

All the best
Jukka

Are you pooking fun at6 us akkuj?

[Robert]

It's here.

http://www.casebook.org/authors/interviews/stewart_evans.2.html

[John Bennett]

Sorry to butt in fellows but did not Stewart Evans dscuss a missing Kelly photo a while back from a collector he got a number of letters from?

Sorry if i'm getting this wrong..just sent bells in the back of my head.

No, you are right. Apparently the person in question claimed to have seen/owned some other photographic material relating to Kelly but could not find it. I can't remember his name, so this may be a good point at which to SPE to intervene...

[Robert]

If he had left initials, would we have a song Jacky Ripper Said?

It was bad enough having Jocky Wilson said.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ao9p3ou7-U

[j.r-ahde]

Hello Sam!

...you mean apart from a variety of initials, and the odd Baphomet or two?

You mean, that there is "FM" on her face too?!

My God, a new clue; in that case Jack was a dis... das... dyslexic!

All the best
Jukka

[Sox]

I doubt it to be quite honest, as most of you know, mortuary shots were taken with the body hung on hooks or at least propped up, due to the dificulties experienced with the camera's of the time in taking photographs at angles.

[steje73]

I think he did, but if I remember, nothing came of it because the chap sadly died.

[Jeff Leahy]

Sorry to butt in fellows but did not Stewart Evans dscuss a missing Kelly photo a while back from a collector he got a number of letters from?

Sorry if i'm getting this wrong..just sent bells in the back of my head.

[Robert]

More disturbingly, you might see the eyes.

[Sam Flynn]

Thinking about her facial injuries, if the photos will ever show up, what could we really see, besides the scars?

...you mean apart from a variety of initials, and the odd Baphomet or two?