Eddowes not killed by jack?

[Mr.Hyde]

Then we'd have Jack the Kipper and no casebook.Bummer!
Give Lika a decent go-entitled to own opinion.

[celee]

If Eddowes wasn't killed by Jack the Ripper, then there was no Jack the Ripper.

Um ya, I have to agree. People deabate the Stride murder, the Kelly murder, the Tabram murder and now Eddowes. If we keep on discounting victims, then Jack killed nobody.

Jack killed four, five or six women. Polly, Annie, Kate and Mary, bank on them. Tabram and Stride may or may not have been a ripper victim.

Your friend, Brad

[Barnaby]

If Eddowes wasn't killed by Jack the Ripper, then there was no Jack the Ripper.

I'm beginning to doubt the very existence of this mysterious Kidney person! I've spent months examining all the census listings and can't find a trace of her under either Virginia or the nickname. Of course, there's another possibility: Instead of "Ginny Kidney," the actual quote could have been, "This is Ginny's kidney," in which case, we should be looking for a woman named Virginia who had a kidney removed at London Hospital around the same time as Kate got her throat cut. I'll let you know what I find out.

I think I did hear of her before....wasnt she Michael's second cousin? We know that she was at least once removed...

Cheers John.

[Dr. John Watson]

I'm beginning to doubt the very existence of this mysterious Kidney person! I've spent months examining all the census listings and can't find a trace of her under either Virginia or the nickname. Of course, there's another possibility: Instead of "Ginny Kidney," the actual quote could have been, "This is Ginny's kidney," in which case, we should be looking for a woman named Virginia who had a kidney removed at London Hospital around the same time as Kate got her throat cut. I'll let you know what I find out.

[Mr.Hyde]

Mr.Hyde

Well, Mike, we certainly shouldn't take those opinions that Eddowes herself had a "ginny" kidney and Bright's Disease at all seriously.

http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/dst-cmdlusk.html

[Limehouse]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Horrocks_Openshaw

From that article:
Following his Fellowship, he was appointed Assistant Demonstrator of Anatomy at the London Hospital Medical College in 1886, and, after his subsequent appointment as Curator of the Pathology Museum in 1887, he extended and catalogued the Museum’s collection of pathological specimens, thereby creating an important research facility for the College’s medical students.

Oh gawd! I wonder where 'e got 'is specimens???

[DVV]

There was a tatoo on the kidney.
It read: "Mary An..."
The remaining part of the sentence, well, Jack swallowed it.
http/en.wikipedia.org://tatoomykidney.com

Hope it helps.

Amitiés all,
David

[Mr.Hyde]

Mr.Hyde

... and the source for that is...?

Hint: not Dr Brown, the man who actually carried out the autopsy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Horrocks_Openshaw

[Sam Flynn]

Unless we can weigh them on a credibility scale, or know who of them graduated top of the class, which medical opinion to accept is problematic.

Well, Mike, we certainly shouldn't take those opinions that Eddowes herself had a "ginny" kidney and Bright's Disease at all seriously.

... and the source for that is...?

Hint: not Dr Brown, the man who actually carried out the autopsy.

I do get your point Sam, ...but is the fact that Bond only touched one Canonical factored when assessing his opinions on how many victims there were, or what skills the killer exhibited in his chosen hobby? One thing that does puzzle me is how different the medical opinions were on some of the various questions they addressed.

Unless we can weigh them on a credibility scale, or know who of them graduated top of the class, which medical opinion to accept is problematic.

To my mind Bond is one of the most fickle with his opinion based on his comments on Alice McKenzies, and the least credible on 4 of the 5 autopsies as being the man who saw only notes....yet he is a widely respected and senior medical authority.

All I can say to address that is, George W Bush was respected by the public and his peers in 2 elections.....yet look at his personal business and military records that pre-dated the elections. And then look what happened.

Best regards Gareth.

[Sam Flynn]

Going against my old amigo Sam on this, there was opinion that Kates remaining kidney had a form of Nephritis...Brights Disease in this case

... and the source for that is...?

Hint: not Dr Brown, the man who actually carried out the autopsy.

Hi Lika,

The package that Lusk recieved was addressed to him incompletely, but it was just as his details had been published in a paper earlier that week. There is a story of a gentleman, gloved, and Irish in appearance that enters a shop a few days before the package arrived, borrowed a local paper that was in the shop with the Lusk address in it, not removing his gloves to do so, and copied down the name and addressed printed.

It has been said by some who study linguistics and graphology that there are hints of Irish in the phrasing and words in "From Hell".

Going against my old amigo Sam on this, there was opinion that Kates remaining kidney had a form of Nephritis...Brights Disease in this case, that the kidney section had been in spirits for the approximate time that had elapsed since Kates murder, and that the kidney section, "trimmed up, also revealed indications of Brights Disease. It was only even considered as Kates due to those factors.

When considering that alcoholism can contribute to this ailment, it seems reasonable to me they were correct.

That doesnt mean its Kates kidney section, only that the condition within in matches one found in Kates remaining kidney, and its been in spirits for approx the length of time that had elapsed since the murder.

On whether Catherine Eddowes was a Ripper victim, I can only say that for me she is the 3rd... with an asterix.

Like Monty I agree the methodology in the pick-up, how he subdues, the throat cut, and abdominal mutilation focus are virtually a match for the features found with Polly and Annie. My reservation about including her has more to do with the circumstances, than the specific actions taken.

Im one of the few people it would seem that dont believe what Jack the Ripper did, ONLY he could do. I think chopping bodies into individual parts reaches Jacks level of disrespect for life, and there was a killer known to do that perhaps 2 or more times during the relevant time period. Meaning...We already know there were at least 2 serial killers loose in London.

Best regards.

[Sam Flynn]

Yes, well what I meant was - I think that those who claimed the kidney could have come from Eddowes were making that assertion based on what was written in the coroner's report.

Indeed, Julie. In fact Dr Brown's report, though minutely detailed, doesn't mention Bright's Disease, the length of the artery left in the body, nor the organ's "ginniness" at all. So, unless there was an unrecorded exhumation, the odds are that the entire story was nothing but brag and bluster - quite in keeping with its most prominent source, the memoirs of Henry "Gurgling-plughole" Smith.

[DVV]

He believed he was watched by a "sinister bearded man".

I highly doubt Jack would just give away his knife especially after I read the first ripper letter.
"My knife's so nice and sharp" seems like he liked his knife alot.

Hi Lika,
In England, "sinister bearded men" are often misleading.
Think of poor Barrymore in The Hound of the Baskerville.
More seriously, fascinated as you are by the From Hell letter, do you think it has been written by the one who signed "Jack the Ripper" in September ?

Amitiés,
David