Did jack kill liz stride?

[lynn cates]

Something old, something new . . .

Hello Christer. Thanks.

Umm, when will the old Christer be back? (heh-heh)

Cheers.
LC

[Ausgirl]

Fisherman, Jon, Lynn - thanks for setting me right. The source book I was reading said 'cashews' not 'cachous'. I just thought it was old fashioned spelling differences of some sort. Breath mints or sweets makes a whole lot more sense, for sure.

[lynn cates]

use

Hello Ausgirl. Thanks. My pleasure.

Well, it would make MORE sense if we knew what she was using them for.

Cheers.
LC

[Wickerman]

She wasn't using them for anything apparently. At least the medics make no mention of her taking the cachous.

Maybe, she was just holding them for a friend

[Michael W Richards]

Hi again,

I think this poll has revealed the mindset of the contributing Ripperologists about this matter,.... and it doesnt seem to me to differ greatly from what I would expect from someone who has never read a Ripper book or studied the cases at all. Interesting that in addressing this question the Informed, being the people here who claim to be serious students of the cases, and the aforementioned Uninformed, would probably opt for the same answer.

For the Uninformed, .......there is no evidence known to exist that links Liz Strides murder with any other in the Whitechapel Unsolved Murders file, and more specifically, no evidence that links Liz Strides murder with either Kate Eddowes, or Annie Chapman,...(the following or preceding unsolved murder in Londons East End in 1888)....or the other 2 ladies that are in what is referred to as the Canonical Group, just 5 women from the total number in the file. There is no primary single suspect for that smaller group. There is no proof that one man killed that smaller group, or a smaller or larger one within the Unsolved file. Instead,.. there are guesses, suppositions, hunches, speculations, theories, and assumptions, made by some contemporary officials, by newspapers and by modern "Ripperologists", in hard cover and paperback..

Strides murder has 4 things in common with these other murders...One is the geographic location,...loosely....2 is the time of year, Fall,... Three, the weapon used in the murder, a knife. And of course Four, the fact that Liz Strides murder, like every other murder file within the Unsolved cases file, was, and is Unsolved. She is killed differently than the others, the knife used on her doesnt match exactly the knives used in earlier murders, and she suffers none of what allowed an unknown killer about the East End to be nicknamed "the Ripper".

Circumstantial evidence alone can be extremely misleading when assessing whether one murder should be grouped with another,.. since it can be contrived or intentionally corrupted, it can be interpreted in a variety of ways, and is almost never enough in and of itself to convict someone of any crime in a unsullied court of law.

All that anyone with any integrity can accurately say about Liz Strides murder is that it happened during a 2 1/2 month period when 4 other unsolved murders took place in East London, it happened at night, and the killer used a knife. And additional information like many other Unsolved murders before and after that 2 1/2 month period... in that same district, some with similar backgrounds and problems... should also be mentioned. Clearly........with virtual certainty,....one can see that no single killer killed all the victims within that file,... more than 11. Ergo, we have unsolved murders by at least 2.. or more... killers. By reviewing the cases we can see that some of the remaining unsolved murders may well be grouped tentatively by a killer, using that pesky Circumstantial Evidence....but only when there is adequate physical evidence to corroborate that assumption. Like finding multiple torso's over a period of years.....unique and unusual acts that were likely linked by the killer or killers.

Its always best to deal with the realities I think. Even in Ripperdom.

Cheers all.

[Hunter]

The reality is that we don't know who killed any of these women. The reality also is that several women of the same class were killed by person or persons unknown with a knife, and without witnesses, in a small geographical area in a short period of time and the usual methods of detection were to no avail.

[The Good Michael]

All that anyone with any integrity can accurately say about Liz Strides murder is that it happened during a 2 1/2 month period when 4 other unsolved murders took place in East London, it happened at night, and the killer used a knife. And additional information like many other Unsolved murders before and after that 2 1/2 month period... in that same district, some with similar backgrounds and problems...

All proven prostitutes, all seem to not have had theft as a motive, all had broken relationships, all were women, very very few cut throats for women in this time period, all circumstances for each murder seem to have been different... all... enough for me to lean to JTR.

Mike

[lynn cates]

the proof of the puddin'

Hello Michael. Proven? Well, very good evidence for Polly and Annie.

Theft? Annie did have her rings stolen.

Different circumstances? Polly and Annie all but said what they were about and both were severely impaired.

Cheers.
LC

[Cogidubnus]

Hi Cris

killed by person or persons unknown with a knife, and without witnesses

Unless of course you count Israel Schwartz

All the best

Dave

[The Good Michael]

Theft? Annie did have her rings stolen.

Then that must mean you think that was the motive. I don't believe it was.

Mike

[Bridewell]

There isn't a 'sit on the fence' option but I'm 60/40 in favour of both Stride and Eddowes having been victims of the same killer.

[Haskins]

There isn't a 'sit on the fence' option but I'm 60/40 in favour of both Stride and Eddowes having been victims of the same killer.

That's the way I look at it too Bridewell. There isn't enough clarity to be sure either way, but Stride was, on the narrow balance of probabilities, likely a ripper victim. I wouldn't place all my chips on it though.

[lynn cates]

motive

Hello Michael. Thanks.

Not sure about motive. Do know her rings were taken.

Cheers.
LC

[Lechmere]

Strides murder has 4 things in common with these other murders...
1 is the geographic location,...loosely....
2 is the time of year, Fall,...
3, the weapon used in the murder, a knife.
4, the fact that Liz Strides murder, like every other murder file within the Unsolved cases file, was, and is Unsolved.

What about…
5. The victims were all prostitutes
6. They were all killed late at night or very early in the morning – when most people were asleep.

Clearly........with virtual certainty,....one can see that no single killer killed all the victims within that file,... more than 11.

These 11?
Smith
Tabram
Nichols
Chapman
Stride
Eddowes
Kelly
Mylett
Mackenzie
Pinchin Street
Coles
I can see all being by one hand – although equally I may excluded one or two.

[Michael W Richards]

The reality is that we don't know who killed any of these women. The reality also is that several women of the same class were killed by person or persons unknown with a knife, and without witnesses, in a small geographical area in a short period of time and the usual methods of detection were to no avail.

Agreed. The only factual reply thus far.

Cheers Hunter