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Vasiliev, Saviour of Lost Souls?

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    dovetailing

    Hello C4. Rachkovski's "Vasiliev story" may have had a fundamentum in re, and the poor devil may actually have been with that sect or a recrudescence thereof.

    But I think that's beside the point. Rachkovski used the story, appropriately tweaked, to suit his purposes--just as I believe he used the first 2 killings (Polly and Annie) for his own purposes by "dovetailing the work" with his own.

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • curious4
    replied
    Rasputin(a)

    Hello Lynn,

    No, sorry, don´t think a Rasputina would be physically capable of what Rasputin was supposed to have got up to!

    Was fairly serious about the Skoptsy though!

    Best wishes,
    C4

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    what's in a name

    Hello C4. Well, Rasputin may actually be Anna Raspoutina--a lady Anarchist who, in actuality, likely had as little to do with the WCM as I did. (Perhaps less, because I DO read a few papers about them. Not so sure that she did.)

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • curious4
    replied
    Hello Lynn,

    Well, I am a big Rasputin fan and am glad of a chance to drag him in! Incidentally his image seems to be undergoing a clean-up these days. Quite saintly it appears!
    Best wishes,
    C4

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    date

    Hello Maria. Thanks. The October date was my impression. Wish I knew if that, too, originated in St. Petersburg. And if it comes from the source I expect, then I can safely take MJK out of the mix and focus on a Rachkovski "Double Event"--as I already believe to be the case.

    I will keep my research posted.

    (Must run off now for my stand up comedy routine.)

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • mariab
    replied
    Originally posted by lynn cates View Post
    Keep me posted should you discover the chronological origin of the Vasiliev story.
    I thought the first mention of Vasiliev was on October 12, 1888, as you said in the Kaufmann thread?
    What I'm mostly interested in is a lead to Le Grand. If you happen to see anything from the Vasiliev campaign in The Echo or in The Northern Eastern Gazette, bingo. (As these are the 2 newspapers in which Le Grand planted stories.) Also, it'll be nice to establish when Le Grand's detective ad stopped appearing vs. when Pịtr Rachkovsky got settled in London in the summer of 1888.
    I'm hoping of joining you in the newspapers search in late March. Right now I'm looking at the different Clubs on Berner Street, but my French article on deadline on Rossini's Le Comte Ory comes first. Darn article is a huge patchwork job, tons of research results to incorporate in pieces and parts.

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    alles gute

    Hello Maria. Good luck with the book and research.

    Keep me posted should you discover the chronological origin of the Vasiliev story.

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • mariab
    replied
    Hello Lynn. Yes I know, a book must sell. Still, for the American version of mine (it it comes out as planned, in the not too near future, by The University of Chicago Press), I'm not gonna cheapen it out. The German version (the manuscript of which I'm still polishing) is deadly serious, but still contains some (dry) humour.
    Plus, look at SPE: His JTR: the first American serial killer is not frilly at all, and yet it became a best seller. (Though of course, JTR sells better than some anarchists.)
    I'll read Rocker when in Paris, as I'm still too busy with stuff prior to that. Gotta have some structure in my readings. ;-)

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    spin

    Hello Curious4. Well, I think "Vasiliev" is a better candidate for a Nobel Prize in literature. It was all PURE spin.

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    rhetoric

    Hello Maria. Yes, I too, prefer strict, factual accounts devoid of rhetoric. But, of course, a book must sell and to do that the prose must be a bit more flowery and flowing.

    I also notice that the murder occurred in November, not December. Slight error.

    Good luck with Rocker.

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • curious4
    replied
    russian connection?

    I have also wondered about a russian connection to JTR involving the Skoptsy sect, who believed in castration and cutting off the breasts of women and also other parts of the female body to save them from "sinning".

    Perhaps Jack had heard of them and was trying to save their souls a la Skoptsy?

    As Vassily was voluntarily castrated, he may well have been a member (sorry) of this sect.

    Regards,
    C4

    Leave a comment:


  • mariab
    replied
    Thank you so much for all the information, Lynn. The Okhrana MO for provocatory jobs sounds pretty much as I expected. In the Guardian report it's almost implied that also Landeisen was involved and escaped. I've most certainly have heard of Landeisen under the name Arcady Harting, still, never had the chance yet to delve into all of his activities.

    I've read parts of Butterworth online, as the book is available to read on the american amazon site (www.amazon.com), on some days only partly, on other days almost in its entirety (this due to copyright law). To be quite honest, what I read from it frequently irritated the hell out of me, as I've found many parts too conversational or even gossipy, but maybe I just lucked out in the passages that were available to read. Still, it's becoming clearer every day that it's unavoidable for me to buy Butterworth, and I'll do this in a few weeks – when I first read your Rocker, which I'm taking along to Paris. (How romantic!)

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    provocateurs

    Hello Maria. If I recall properly, General S was former police chief of St. Petersburg. He had become recent head of another organisation which was, in some way, a bit of an Okhrana rival (third section). Padlewski was apparently (Butterworth) meeting with Okhrana people (eg, Rachkovski's agent Iuliana Glinka) and making trips to Paris. So he became a fall guy.

    Normally, when the Okhrana hired an agent provocateur, he would set up a group of anarchists, the police would be called in, the agent would be arrested and then, as if by magic, he would "escape" or be sent abroad for "punishment." With that ruse, the agent could be recycled.

    I take it you have yet to read Butterworth? It's a very illuminating read.

    Landeisen (Landesen)? He was a very old and trusted Okhrana agent (in fact, he was Jewish [Abraham Hekkelman/Arcady Harting]--if you like irony). If I recall properly, he eventually became head of the Okhrana foreign bureau but was "outed" around 1909 (my guess would be by the anarchist intelligence figure, Burtsev). I believe Butterworth has him escaping to Belgium where he lived under protection.

    Cheers.
    LC

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  • mariab
    replied
    Lynn, was General Seliverstoff in the Russian equivalent of the justice department or something, was Padlewski the alleged terrorist bomber, and Landeisen an Okhrana spy? You happen to know that the story was planted by Rachkovsky via Butterworth?
    As you've said, The Guardian clearly reacts with due scepticism, but then again, The Guardian has a tradition of never having been a conservative paper.

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  • lynn cates
    replied
    story

    Hello Maria. Well, Jagolkovsky came forward about 10 years later and admitted his role. In another 10 years (Butterworth) this motive was alleged. The idea is that Rachkovski saw him as competition.

    I have pasted a snippet from "The Guardian" December 31, 1890 below. It is based on the planted story by Rachkovski. Unfortunately for Rachkovski, the story fell apart due to an alibi and so he had another one planted.

    As you can see, the story is already being questioned.

    Cheers.
    LC
    Attached Files

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