Sickert's Merits as a Painter (moved thread)

[BillyE]

Actually, it's because Sickert's work is a little disturbing that I kind of like it. Does that make me weird? Probably so. Anyway, it would be rather funny if the artist spelled his last name with an "a" rather than an "e". Then his name would be Sickart, sick art. I'm surprised some Ripperologist hasn't jumped on that tangent. Some have made greater leaps than that.

[evilina]

Sickert as an artist

I have seen a couple of Sickert's paintings up close and personal. There are 2? in the Queensland art gallery collection. I have to say that i really didn't like the paintings. Now I have done some study in visual art (not too much i will admit - i majored in music and needed to pick up some extra subjects) but nowhere near enough to have an educated opinion.

I was really keen to see his paintings (I had already read 'The Final Solution') and was convinced that I would be able to see coded messages in the canves. (I really couldn't) and found them a little disturbing. I wonder if this was because i had read about him? Or if it was because the paintings are disturbing? Either way I really don't like them!

[Limehouse]

Hi Natalie,

Yes, I too like their personal projection in relation to what surrounds them and what they choose to paint. I am really interested in psychogeography and started to look at more of their work through my own interest in this and how it relates to the east end for people like Ian Sinclair.

Hi Joe,

Try this site:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=gilbert+and+George&btnG=Google+Search&meta=

Good luck!

[Natalie Severn]

I like Gilbert and George,Limehouse. Those repectable suits play well against the batty bonker stuff they like to project.......

[joesheehan]

Gilbert and george

I like what I know of them which is somewhat limited. I touched upon them in relation to the Chapman Brothers while researching a previous essay for my course. I was working on some marionettes at the time and tried to draw parallels between the Chapman's manipulation of the press and Victorian era puppet shows but I was not altogether successful!! I read a bit into Gilbert and George at the time and was interested by their refusal to differentiate between their art persona and their everyday lives but I am not too familiar with their work. Is there anything you would recommend beginning with?

[Limehouse]

Joe,

Do you like Gilbert and George?

[Natalie Severn]

I agree 100% with the above posts. Sickert is certainly not everyone"s cup of tea -I do like Picasso and find the range of work he covered terrific but some of it is pretty grotesque .Sickert while not exactly in the same class as Picasso produced work of distinctive merit and innovative style.

[joesheehan]

Uninspiring

Even if you consider Sickert's work uninspiring this is no reason to relegate him to the 'second division' of art history.Sickert's influence can be seen in the work of Freud, Bacon, Hirst and the Chapman brothers. You could even argue his use of photography and media imagery mark him out as a forerunner of Pop art.
Also, artists such as David Hockney and Patrick Caulfield in reaction against the Sickert influenced art scene of their youth went on to create some of the defining works of their generation. Whether loved or hated Sickert has inspired much in the modern art world and so cannot be considered a footnote

[revpetero]

I may be way off line here and please tell me if you feel I am.

It seems to me that people tend to let their dislike/views of PC cloud their judgement of Sickerts art.

Every artist will always have his/her critics. Walter Sickert may not be everybodies cup of tea but there is no doubting that he was a very talented artist.

Me myself I am not a fan of Picasso but I am fully aware of how talented he was.

Peter

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks Limehouse,
I agree its a shame but things are improving with regards to women getting recognition these days although the market now is almost solely in the hands of the super rich like Charles Satchi and co!
Cheers
Norma [Nats]

[Limehouse]

Hi Natalie,

Great post.

Shame about the women painters because they did paint. Women of a certain class were taught painting and drawing - but of course they were not permitted to exhibit their works as often as men were and they were not really taken seriously until the start of the 20th century.

I agree, Sickert was a great painter and so important and of course, the Cornwell book has at least revived an interest in his work.

Limehouse

[Natalie Severn]

I noticed this thread with regards to British Artists.
For a kick off Turner is considered to be one of the very greatest painters who ever lived.As a painter he is up there with the likes of Titian,Velasquez,Rembrandt,Rubens and just a few others.
Both Constable and Gainsborough are also rated very high,internationally.
Sickert too ranks.He is England"s greatest post Impressionist painter, and one of the first to use newspaper photographs as sources for paintings.He was a pupil of Whistler-also a well rated artist -and worked with Degas,the French painter in Paris.Sickert doesnt appeal to everybody because some of the the subjects he chose to paint,and the thick brush strokes he often used to depict poor prostitutes lying naked on old sheets in dingy rooms-can be depressing viewing.But that was what he wanted to show-the reality of their wretched lives and he did so brilliantly.We certainly do have some great artists.
We dont have that many great women painters its true,but we have some lovely paintings by Gwen John and quite a few more modern women painters.

[Jeff Leahy]

Posted by pirate Jack.

but the fact is that Anglo Saxons are good at craft and trade.....they have never produced a good artist

So you don't consider Constable or Turner to be 'good' artists? How about B W Leader or Dadds?

I think a few million people might disagree with you on that point.

Fair comment Bob, I must admit here I was being a little provocative..

However my contention, when talking about this period in art would be the masters to consider (please excuss spelling)

MANNET, RENIOR, PISCARO, MONET, MATISSE, VAN GOUGH, perhaps GOGAN

The French were the masters, most english painting is somewhat of side note..in art history terms, anyway

But I really dont want to getbogged down in my veiws on Sickerts painting ability...its irrelivant.

Better get back to FCP class...

[Limehouse]

And don't forget Willaim Blake, William Holman Hunt, George Stubbs - and a legion of female artists and if you like your art modern - what about Francis Bacon, Lucian Freud, L S Lowery. And what of designers such as Willam Morris and Edwin Lutyens whose artistic skill extended to beautiful buildings, furniture and wallpapers/fabrics?

[Bob Hinton]

Pardon?

Posted by pirate Jack.

but the fact is that Anglo Saxons are good at craft and trade.....they have never produced a good artist

So you don't consider Constable or Turner to be 'good' artists? How about B W Leader or Dadds?

I think a few million people might disagree with you on that point.