To diagnose a serial killer

[GUT]

So - completely sane then.

There is a big difference between having (or not having) a psychiatric disorder and being Criminally (in)sane.

Sanity is purely a legal test

[RivkahChaya]

BTW, "PD" stands for "personality disorder," not "psychiatric disorder," and people with PDs are not crazy in any sense, in that they are not psychotic, nor manic. They generally are well-grounded in reality, but sometimes they are highly dysfunctional, and sometimes not. Really, when you know one person with a PD, you know one person with a PD. Some people are more highly affected, and some of the PDs allow for easier functioning. It also depends on what sort of talents the person has, and how they mesh with the person's ability to cope with being around other people.

A lot of modern serial killers have been diagnosed with PDs, but that doesn't mean that the PD caused the killing, because PDs are pretty common. It probably has more to do either with a common causation-- like how deafness and cerebral palsy commonly occur together, but most deaf people do not have CP-- or it has to do with something like the impulse or desire to kill occurs more often than it happens. In other words, there are people who have the seedling of a fetish that could lead to killing people, but they don't do it, because they are otherwise normal. You need something else, like a personality disorder, ADHD (an impulse control problem), or a head injury to unleash the feeling.

Just like any parent can become abusive, but it usually takes the convergence of a number of stressors, like a difficult child (including an easy one who happens to be sick and cranky), lack of money, a single parent whose babysitter cancels, or the other parent calling to say he has to work mandatory overtime, and then the washing machine overflows, and that's the day the child gets hit. I haven't had a day like that, but I've been lucky. I've had those things happen, just not converge. Wealthy people with lots of resources who "don't understand how someone can hit a kid," have a room they can go into where there are no kids. Some people don't have that luxury.

So, yeah, serial killers do have PDs, probably at a slightly higher rate than the general population, but having a PD does not suggest that someone will have a PD. Same with a head injury. And same with other violent crimes, not just serial killing.

[The Good Michael]

The only reason to categorize mental disorders is so that people may be treated with drugs or therapies, and these treatments often do not work and are always re-evaluated and adjusted. What that means is, categorization and labeling are incorrect and each case has to be treated differently. These labels also create stigmas that prevent most people from ever feeling part of a normal society. Too, similar "experts" lump people into racial and ethnic categories with similar results of social discomfort. Psychology is useful as an experiment in misunderstanding an individual's needs. It has no great application retrospectively to the Ripper case. Comparisons with modern serial killers throughout various decades are made invalid due to different criminologists and doctors with different theories evaluating different killers with different methods and from different upbringings with different air to breathe and different drinking water and different chemical dependencies and different environmental hazards. Any poster wishing to compare mental illnesses of today with what they think JTR was like has to contend with all those factors first and then...it is still only opinion.

Mike

[Simon Wood]

Hi Pierre,

There are many methods for solving murder cases.

Trying to retrofit a psychiatric profile onto the Whitechapel murderer[s?] at this remove is not one of them.

What you should be investigating are all the various reasons why people want—even need—Jack the Ripper to have existed.

Regards,

Simon

[curious4]

Many caught Serial Killers have not been found to have any psychiatric disorders at all

So - completely sane then.

[belinda]

Many caught Serial Killers have not been found to have any psychiatric disorders at all

[RivkahChaya]

Pierre, are you a psychiatrist, psychologist, or neurologist? I worked with disabled people for many years, and I'm here to tell you that lay people are not qualified to make diagnoses. Further, no qualified person would ever make a diagnosis of someone he had not met.

I say this as someone who went through 30+ hours of training to be qualified to make referrals for diagnoses, and sat in consultations with clients and families, as an advocate while professionals explained why a person was being diagnose with X as opposed to Y, or why one thing was a primary diagnosis, and something else was a secondary diagnosis.

[Pierre]

Bonjour Pierre,

You're absolutely right.

There is no evidence for a Jack the Ripper, except for all the bogus rubbish which has been invented over the years.

Regards,

Simon

Hi Simon,

And just because there is no evidence as far as you can see, and given that we do have a lot of what you call bogus rubbish, that still doesnīt mean that Jack the Ripper didnīt exist.

I can understand your interest in the deconstruction of ripperology but such methods arenīt methods for solving murder cases.

Regards Pierre

[Simon Wood]

Hi RivkahChaya,



Regards,

Simon

[RivkahChaya]

Bonjour Pierre,

You're absolutely right.

There is no evidence for a Jack the Ripper, except for all the bogus rubbish which has been invented over the years.

Regards,

Simon

Yay! Your book is a Kindle Unlimited, which I subscribe to! As soon as I finish my current book, its my next read.

[Simon Wood]

Bonjour Pierre,

You're absolutely right.

There is no evidence for a Jack the Ripper, except for all the bogus rubbish which has been invented over the years.

Regards,

Simon

[Pierre]

Bonjour Pierre,

Very interesting, save for one thing—

There was no Jack the Ripper.

Regards,

Simon

Hi Simon,

Well thanks. But the reason you say so is you havenīt found any evidence for a Jack the Ripper.

And there are also trees falling in the woods even when you donīt know about it.

And even now I guess there must be some murder happening without us knowing it and without anyone ever knowing who the murderer was.

Regards Pierre

[Simon Wood]

Bonjour Pierre,

Very interesting, save for one thing—

There was no Jack the Ripper.

Regards,

Simon

[Pierre]

Hi,

I can understand that itīs tempting to think oneīs theory about a serial killer, whatever theory you have, could get support from theories of phychiatric disorders (PD).

Spontaineously it goes well with what people generally think about a serial killer. He must have some kind of psychiatric disorder, he must be insane.

Even in 1888 the thinking went along this line. Jack the Ripper had to be a "lunatic". Perhaps the murders even stopped because he was put away in an asylum. This type of idea was thus given an explanatory status.

But the thing is that itīs very hard to diagnose serial killers even when they are alive and are beeing tested for different PD:s.

Doing it with historical sources is impossible - they donīt test the killer, they only describe crime scenes or what witnesses have thought and said.

So why do ripperologists use this old and very irrelevant idea of the killer having to be insane, mad, a psychopath etc? Because it says nothing about the mental status of Jack the Ripper but it says a lot of what people would expect from a serial killer, would he ever be tested for having some type of PD.

So hereīs a list of possible diagnoses from a rather rescent bibliographical review (Full article: http://www.scielo.br/pdf/rbp/v28s2/en_04.pdf) Have a go at it and try to diagnose Jack the Ripper from the list!

You will probably find that you think he could have many diagnoses.

You will also probably find that some of the literature you have read about him about him reflects different aspects and traits in this list.


Classification

The ICD-10 describes eight types of specific PDs: paranoid,
schizoid, antisocial, emotionally unstable, histrionic,
anankastic, anxious, and dependent.

1) Paranoid PD is characterized by self-referential thinking:
a predominance of distrust, oversensitivity to setbacks, and
the perception of being constantly harmed by others.

2) Schizoid PD is predominated by detachment, a lack of
interest in social contact, affective withdrawal, difficulty in
feeling pleasure, and a tendency toward introspection.

3) Antisocial PD is characterized by indifference to the
feelings of others (which can lead the individual to adopt
cruel behavior), disdain for norms and obligations, a low
tolerance for frustration, and a low threshold for the
perpetration of violent acts.

4) Emotionally unstable PD is marked by impulsive and
unpredictable manifestations, presenting two subtypes:
impulsive and borderline. The impulsive subtype is
characterized by emotional instability and uncontrolled
impulses. The borderline subtype, in addition to emotional
instability, presents self-image perturbations (causing difficulty
in defining personal preferences) and a consequent feeling of
emptiness.

5) Histrionic PD is characterized by a prevalence of
egocentrism and a low tolerance for frustration, as well as
theatricality and superficiality. Individuals with histrionic PD
are ruled by the need to be the center of attention.

6) In anankastic PD, concern about details prevails, together
with rigidity and stubbornness. However, the repetitive and
intrusive thoughts seen in anankastic PD do not attain the
level of severity that would lead to a diagnosis of obsessivecompulsive disorder.

7) Anxious (or elusive) PD is predominated by oversensitivity to
criticism, persistent feelings of tension/apprehension, and a
tendency toward social withdrawal (due to insecurity regarding
social capacity, professional capacity, or both).

8) Dependent PD is characterized by behavioral deficit, lack of
determination and lack of initiative, as well as by an unstable
sense of purpose.

Regards Pierre